>> Ok, I rephrase my question. >> Could you define what you consider a usage of dependency A because of B and >> the opposite?
I'll dare explaining Indirect dependency (no dependency on A should be defined in C): C ----> B ----> A * C uses classes from B * B uses classes from A * C does NOT use classes from A Direct dependency (explicit dependency on A should be defined in C) C ----> B ----> A \_ _ _ _ _ _ _^ * C uses classes from B * B uses classes from A * C uses classes from A -----Original Message----- From: devs [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Denis Gervalle Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2014 16:10 PM To: XWiki Developers Subject: Re: [xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Cleaning our POM deps by explicitly listing used dependencies? On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 2:27 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]> wrote: > On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 2:14 PM, Denis Gervalle <[email protected]> wrote: > > What happen if you also use dependency A not just because of B ? > > You put a dependency on A. > But you may not see that so easily when you change a few line in an existing module. Nothing will complains until you remove your deps to B. > > > How do you determine "because of B" ? > > By thinking. > Ok, I rephrase my question. Could you define what you consider a usage of dependency A because of B and the opposite ? > > > > > And what to you think of xwiki-commons-test-component that is a deps > > of xwiki-platform-core ? > > It's wrong IMO. Any forced dependency is wrong IMO. > > > Should we remove it ? > > Yes we should remove it. > Why do we get it ? Its removal could become an nightmare... but if we agree on that, we should remove it ASAP. > > > What about deps for logging ? > > Depends how you use it, the logger used with @Inject is an official > feature of our component framework so xwiki-commons-component-api > should be enough. > > > And could we add xwiki-commons-stability (probably provided scope) > > to a high level pom to avoid adding/removing it all the time ? (or > > forget it, since it come with xwiki-commons-component-api currently) ? > > It's far from being used everywhere and there is no rule forcing to > use it, you set @Unstable when an API is unstable, it's not forbidden > to not go through @Unstable. Plus you are supposed to remove that > annotation after some time. > Ok, so not deps at any scope in any high level poms. This seems opposite to what Sergiu proposed, but it would be nice to agree on a rule. To sum up, currently I am not sure the exception rule "because of" is clear enough to not create confusion. I also agree with Sergiu that we should list all (no warning of used deps not declared in dependency:analysis), this make the rule clear at least. I am not against factoring common infrastructure in a single place, but Thomas seems to be clearly -1. It would be nice to have more feedback from other committers ! This is not a minor aspect of our best practice IMO. > > > > > WDYT ? > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 11:42 AM, Thomas Mortagne < > [email protected]> > > wrote: > > > >> For me the rule to apply is simple: when you require dependency A > >> because of another dependency B (B expose A in it's API, you > >> implement an interface of A to be found by B, etc.) you should not > >> explicitly depend on A. > >> > >> On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 11:32 AM, Denis Gervalle <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > Hi devs, > >> > > >> > I am reviving this proposal since we never came to a conclusion, > >> > and I > >> have > >> > the feeling that our deps become more and more convoluted. > >> > > >> > To resume what I get from past history with my own vision: > >> > > >> > 1) Since our modules are getting really modular, it should never > silently > >> > depends on transitive dependency of another module (with IMO some > >> > exception, see 3). So any undeclared deps found by > >> > dependency:analyse should be explicitly declare in the effective > >> > pom (Vincent POV as > well) > >> > 2) Apply maven principle, we should reuse and apply > >> > convention-over-configuration over configuration, so common > >> > dependency like slf4j, > >> xwiki-commons-stability > >> > ? ... should be in a high level parent pom > >> > 3) We may rely on some very tight transitive dependency, for > >> > exemple, > it > >> > would be really curious that xwiki-commons-component-api stop > providing > >> > javax.inject, or that xwki-commons-test-components stop providing > junit, > >> > mockito, and al. > >> > > >> > It would be nice to add those rules in our best practice and to > >> > always check our pom upon finishing changes in a module. The best > >> > would be to enforce those rules, but this is not easy since > >> > static analysis is > >> limited > >> > and could create false positive. > >> > > >> > WDYT ? > >> > > >> > > >> > On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 10:31 PM, Thomas Mortagne < > >> [email protected] > >> >> wrote: > >> > > >> >> On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 9:25 PM, Vincent Massol > >> >> <[email protected]> > >> >> wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> > On Aug 12, 2011, at 4:45 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> >> On 08/12/2011 07:50 AM, Vincent Massol wrote: > >> >> >>> Hi devs, > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> Running mvn dependency:dependency-analyze produces > >> >> >>> interesting > >> results. > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> For example: > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> [INFO] > >> >> > >> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------- > >> >> >>> [INFO] Building XWiki Commons - Properties 3.2-SNAPSHOT > >> >> >>> [INFO] > >> >> > >> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------- > >> >> >>> … > >> >> >>> [INFO] --- maven-dependency-plugin:2.3:analyze (default-cli) > >> >> >>> @ > >> >> xwiki-commons-properties --- > >> >> >>> [WARNING] Used undeclared dependencies found: > >> >> >>> [WARNING] org.slf4j:slf4j-api:jar:1.6.1:compile > >> >> >>> [WARNING] javax.inject:javax.inject:jar:1:compile > >> >> >>> [WARNING] Unused declared dependencies found: > >> >> >>> [WARNING] > >> >> > > org.xwiki.commons:xwiki-commons-component-api:jar:3.2-SNAPSHOT:compile > >> >> >>> [WARNING] > >> org.xwiki.commons:xwiki-commons-test:jar:3.2-SNAPSHOT:test > >> >> >>> [WARNING] > org.hibernate:hibernate-validator:jar:4.2.0.Final:test > >> >> >>> [WARNING] org.hamcrest:hamcrest-core:jar:1.1:test > >> >> >>> [WARNING] org.jmock:jmock:jar:2.5.1:test > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> The question is (for this module but more generally for all > others): > >> >> >>> * Should we add slf4j and javax.inject reps in the pom.xml > >> >> >>> for > this > >> >> module? (for ex today slf4j and javax.inject are found in the > >> component-api > >> >> dep) > >> >> >>> > >> >> >>> I think we should, wdyt? > >> >> >> > >> >> >> +1 as well. > >> >> > > >> >> > hmm actually we need to decide about the following: > >> >> > > >> >> > * In order to simplify writing pom.xml for modules having > components > >> >> (i.e. depending on xwiki-commons-component-api) I had added the > >> following > >> >> to xwiki-commons-component-api/pom.xml: > >> >> > > >> >> > <!-- Make it easy for components that wish to log - They > >> >> > don't > have > >> >> to explicitly import SLF4J --> > >> >> > <dependency> > >> >> > <groupId>org.slf4j</groupId> > >> >> > <artifactId>slf4j-api</artifactId> > >> >> > </dependency> > >> >> > > >> >> > * In the same manner we have a dependency on javax.inject in > >> >> xwiki-commons-component-api/pom.xml: > >> >> > > >> >> > <!-- We add this dependency here so that users of the > >> >> > Component > API > >> >> just need to depend on this artifact and > >> >> > don't have to explicitly add a dependency on > >> >> javax.inject:java.inject. --> > >> >> > <dependency> > >> >> > <groupId>javax.inject</groupId> > >> >> > <artifactId>javax.inject</artifactId> > >> >> > <version>1</version> > >> >> > </dependency> > >> >> > > >> >> > So the question is: do we want to force each module depending > >> >> > on > >> >> xwiki-commons-component-api to have to declare an explicit dep > >> >> on javax.inject and org.slf4j? > >> >> > > >> >> > I'm not so sure about that… > >> >> > >> >> I'm -0 and near -1 to list this kind of dependencies, using > >> >> slf4j or javax.inject are what you HAVE TO use when you write an > >> >> XWiki component so it's redundant from my POV. > >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > WDYT? > >> >> > > >> >> > Thanks > >> >> > -Vincent > >> >> > > >> >> >>> Note that the "Unused declared dependencies found:" doesn't > always > >> >> generate correct results as is the case here. This is mostly > >> >> because > >> it's a > >> >> static byte code check so any dep used at runtime will be > >> >> considered > >> unused. > >> >> >>> See > >> >> > >> > http://www.sonatype.com/books/mvnex-book/reference/optimizing-sect-dep > endency-plugin.html > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Some of these dependencies are not used directly by us, but > >> >> >> are > >> needed > >> >> >> transitively by another library. For example, slf4j needs > >> >> >> logback, > >> which > >> >> >> we never use directly (although we don't really declare it in > every > >> >> >> module that does logging). Hibernate needs us to pick a > >> >> >> cache, a connection pool, validator, and a bytecode manipulation > >> >> >> utility. > So > >> yes, > >> >> >> we can safely ignore most of these false negatives, but we > >> >> >> should > >> still > >> >> >> try to remove those that are really wrongfully declared as > >> dependencies. > >> >> >> > >> >> >>> Thanks > >> >> >>> -Vincent > >> >> > > >> >> > _______________________________________________ > >> >> > devs mailing list > >> >> > [email protected] > >> >> > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > >> >> > > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> Thomas Mortagne > >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> devs mailing list > >> >> [email protected] > >> >> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Denis Gervalle > >> > SOFTEC sa - CEO > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > devs mailing list > >> > [email protected] > >> > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Thomas Mortagne > >> _______________________________________________ > >> devs mailing list > >> [email protected] > >> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Denis Gervalle > > SOFTEC sa - CEO > > _______________________________________________ > > devs mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > > > > -- > Thomas Mortagne > _______________________________________________ > devs mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs > -- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs _______________________________________________ devs mailing list [email protected] http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
