Good points Adi and Alec. However I stick by my initial skepticism of the feedback you've gotten Adi.
Informed or not, such assertions unfortunately and inevitably perpetuate an unnecessary negative image of the open access journal, even one that receives due criticism since it does not publish the most interesting or well-received science. Even on the FC list I do not think it good to assume our ideas of open access are all at the same maturity, which would thus allow us to take such comments with a grain if salt. It is imperative we refrain from reproducing opinions in this manner else we become complicit in the accumulation of wealth of misinformation and misinterpretation surrounding open access journals. Adi you're right about the TreeHugger article, they could have gone with a more clearly impactful journal. This may inform us of the naivete of the article or some misunderstandings of PLoS's journal structure. However, I take issue with the follow-up justification you provided for the reasons above. - Matt ----- Reply message ----- From: "Adi Kamdar" <[email protected]> Date: Wed, Sep 29, 2010 8:00 am Subject: [FC-discuss] Open Source Projects featured on TreeHugger To: "Discussion of Free Culture in general and this organization in particular" <[email protected]> It's hard, if not impossible, to speak of PLoS by lumping them all together. PLoS Pathogens, for example, is an extremely well respected and high impact (thus very competitive) journal. The "dumping ground" quote came from a pretty esteemed researcher here at Yale, and other researchers I've talked to have corroborated on that opinion. They all think it's unfortunate that PLoS ONE has become like that, but sometimes the reality of the situation strays from our free cultural ideals. Journal publishing isn't all that clean-cut happy-dappy as people make it out to be... And no, it's not the openness of PLoS ONE that makes it a dumping ground. It's just not well established, and they're willing to accept publications that go against the standard dogma. If you're going to tout an open access journal (re the Treehugger article), PLoS Path or other journals would be MUCH better examples. -Adi On Wed, Sep 29, 2010 at 10:06 AM, Alec Story <[email protected]> wrote: > Yeah, for biology PLoS One is pretty well-respected. Obviously, > introducing any new journal (open or not) is going to have challenges with > impact and quality. I think that people attacking the lower-quality ones > are mistaking openness for the fault, where really it's just that the > journal isn't popular enough to have a high impact (yet?). > > On Wed, Sep 29, 2010 at 3:16 AM, [email protected] < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> That "dumping ground" quote made me lol. Glad you take inspiration from >> PLoS, Parker, I'm there with you. Adi, did that feedback go through some >> reputable, peer-reviewed process? ;) >> >> PLoS One may not be the most prestigious journal but old feedback from >> some UC librarians suggested to me it is a solid journal. >> >> In fact I contend that the PLoS journals arent even that radical (read: >> scary, non-scientific)! It is the same peer-review model, same closed up >> scientific process, same busted reputation engine. >> >> However, these are big issues and PLoS need not necessarily take them on. >> I appreciate PLoS for what they have done to reformulate access, revenue, >> and business models for publishing science research. This may be what makes >> them worthy of recognition. >> >> - Matt >> >> ----- Reply message ----- >> From: "Parker Higgins" <[email protected]> >> Date: Tue, Sep 28, 2010 11:49 pm >> Subject: [FC-discuss] Open Source Projects featured on TreeHugger >> To: "Discussion of Free Culture in general and this organization in >> particular" <[email protected]> >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 29, 2010 at 7:55 AM, Adi Kamdar <[email protected]> wrote >> > >> > >> > It's interesting how they put PLoS ONE in there, though, which most >> > researchers I've talked to tend to regard as the "dumping ground for bad >> > science," or simply an outlet for scientific publications that >> researchers >> > know won't make it into more esteemed journals. >> > >> > >> Yikes. I wonder if that's grounded in fact or just FUD? Hearing about >> PLoS's >> (partially successful) struggle to get scientists to use open access >> journals was actually what first got me passionate about free culture >> issues; that people would opt for the "esteemed" journals instead of the >> newer but more accessible one in cases that were literally life or death >> for >> many people struck me as something that I needed to get involved with. >> >> I can't speak too much to PLoS ONE's credibility, but it is a peer >> reviewed >> journal and not quite a "dumping ground." Some of PLoS's other journals, >> like PLoS Biology, are more obviously successful: in 2007 that journal had >> the highest impact factor of any ISI-categorized "Biology" journal. >> >> >> >> > -Adi >> > >> > >> Parker >> >> -- >> parker higgins >> berlin, germany >> >> http://parkerhiggins.net >> >> gmail / gchat: [email protected] >> twitter / identi.ca: @thisisparker >> skype: thisisparker >> >> please consider software freedom before reading this e-mail on a >> proprietary >> platform >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Discuss mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss >> FAQ: http://wiki.freeculture.org/Fc-discuss >> >> > > > -- > Alec Story > Cornell University > Biological Sciences, Computer Science 2012 > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > [email protected] > http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss > FAQ: http://wiki.freeculture.org/Fc-discuss > >
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