Peter, Again, I am still awaiting an answer that addresses the concerns raised in/by the community.....
Vriendelijke groet, Marc Vloemans > Op 15 mei 2016 om 10:59 heeft Peter Baumann <p.baum...@jacobs-university.de> > het volgende geschreven: > > Marc, > > it puzzles me that all over the (derogative, right?) word "dictatorship" is > eagerly used while you now frown on "activist". > If we are minding language now we should _all_ be careful. > > -Peter > > > >> On 05/15/2016 03:22 AM, Marc Vloemans wrote: >> Peter, >> >> With regard to Rob's comments: I conclude that the various commentators have >> repeatedly pointed out that your line of reasoning is either based on a >> non-representative and even faulty sample of experiences/examples (eg Jeroen >> and Rob) or on the software's quality and popularity in certain circles (eg >> Rob) without clarifying that particular correlation to its project >> management. >> >> In scientific terms that means your thesis/argument does not hold up. By the >> way, citing sources on quality still does not tell anything about above >> correlation, so spare yourself the effort. And comparing Rasdaman to other >> OSGeoprojects still makes it an odd-one-out, which no side-stepping the >> concerns raised can hide. >> >> Effectively, we seem to be running in circles. But ..... we are not: all >> commentators have been quite inviting, but you still cannot convince them >> with true and relevant reasons. You have even resorted to calling at least >> me and (hopefully not too many) others along the way 'activists'. Wording >> that fits lesser democratic countries, organisations and political systems. >> If that gives an insight into the way you look at and treat >> stakeholders/community members with a different view from yours, then I fear >> you have shown our community your true 'colors'/face/intention.... >> >> That is not running in circles but straight into the abyss, somewhere >> in-between OSGeo and Eclipse/LocationTech and other natural allies, in an >> irrational and suicidal attempt ....... to achieve what exactly ???? >> >> Vriendelijke groet, >> Marc Vloemans >> >> >> Op 14 mei 2016 om 15:00 heeft Rob Emanuele <rdemanu...@gmail.com> het >> volgende geschreven: >> >>> Hi Peter, >>> >>> This is the second time I've heard you defend your position by simply >>> saying the greatness of the project justifies whatever model you'd like for >>> project governance, and mention some independent study that claims your >>> software is "way faster" and "wins all benchmarks". These are bold, general >>> and unqualified claims that I would greatly like to understand in a more >>> detailed way. Please site your sources. >>> >>> Best, >>> Rob >>> >>>> On May 14, 2016 5:43 AM, "Peter Baumann" <p.baum...@jacobs-university.de> >>>> wrote: >>>> OpenHub knows 66 code contributors, and they do not even know (and list) >>>> all over time. Hence, cannot see anyone felt discouraged. Typical rasdaman >>>> contributors are interested in design by innovation and not design by >>>> committee, and that community spirit has made rasdaman a leading tool that >>>> wins all benchmarks over GeoServer, SPARK, etc. >>>> -Peter >>>> >>>> PS: suggesting a fork just because OSGeo follows a narrow principle that >>>> does not accommodate rasdaman makes me frown about the ideals behind :) >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 05/12/2016 02:57 PM, Ian Turton wrote: >>>>> I've been trying to stay out of the arguments about governance models >>>>> because I prefer to write code than worry about licences or governance. >>>>> But it may help if I share a some anecdotes (which is almost data) about >>>>> a couple of FOSS projects that came out of academia when I was in charge. >>>>> One of these you may well have heard of GeoTools, which forms the base >>>>> library of GeoServer, UDig, GeoMesa and others, the other you may not >>>>> know GeoVista Studio. >>>>> >>>>> Both these libraries started out as academic projects that solved a >>>>> research problem, both were open sourced as a result of the university >>>>> claiming all the intellectual property of it's staff for ever (so why not >>>>> give it away?) in both cases I (and James Macgil) were benevolent >>>>> dictators when the projects launched, it was a simple governance model >>>>> that left us able to get on with coding and researching and meant that >>>>> things went the way we wanted. GeoTools started to get some users and >>>>> people started asking for bug fixes and new features etc while James & I >>>>> had actual jobs to do and wanted to spend time with our families and go >>>>> on holiday etc. So we got some more people involved such as TOPP and >>>>> Refractions and we sort of lucked into a PSC and GeoTools went from >>>>> strength to strength and now has a PSC that spans the globe (which makes >>>>> meeting times hard to find but is otherwise awesome). In fact for a while >>>>> GeoTools and GeoServer managed (or thrived) with no input from me or >>>>> James at all. However GeoVISTA studio, only went open source grudgingly >>>>> (the PI's didn't want to give up control really) and never really gained >>>>> more than a few users because we didn't allow other people to influence >>>>> the direction of development (after all the university/PI was paying for >>>>> the development) and thus there were only ever two or three developers. >>>>> As BD I had no real interest in attracting new users (previous experience >>>>> had taught me that's hard work). Once James and then I moved on to other >>>>> jobs development stopped (though apparently someone downloaded a copy >>>>> last week). >>>>> >>>>> I'll leave you to draw your own conclusions but my feeling is that to >>>>> make the move from an academic to successful FOSS project you need to >>>>> move from dictatorship to committee run projects. If nothing else it >>>>> allows you some down time from running the project while never needing to >>>>> give up having a say in the running. >>>>> >>>>> Ian >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> PS Some recent emails have tried to suggest that governance doesn't >>>>> matter if you have forkability but I think that is a flawed view - but if >>>>> it is true maybe we could just fork RASDAMAN and be done with the >>>>> discussion? :-) >>>>> -- >>>>> Ian Turton >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Discuss mailing list >>>>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org >>>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dr. Peter Baumann >>>> - Professor of Computer Science, Jacobs University Bremen >>>> www.faculty.jacobs-university.de/pbaumann >>>> mail: p.baum...@jacobs-university.de >>>> tel: +49-421-200-3178, fax: +49-421-200-493178 >>>> - Executive Director, rasdaman GmbH Bremen (HRB 26793) >>>> www.rasdaman.com, mail: baum...@rasdaman.com >>>> tel: 0800-rasdaman, fax: 0800-rasdafax, mobile: +49-173-5837882 >>>> "Si forte in alienas manus oberraverit hec peregrina epistola incertis >>>> ventis dimissa, sed Deo commendata, precamur ut ei reddatur cui soli >>>> destinata, nec preripiat quisquam non sibi parata." (mail disclaimer, AD >>>> 1083) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Discuss mailing list >>>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org >>>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Discuss mailing list >>> Discuss@lists.osgeo.org >>> http://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > -- > Dr. Peter Baumann > - Professor of Computer Science, Jacobs University Bremen > www.faculty.jacobs-university.de/pbaumann > mail: p.baum...@jacobs-university.de > tel: +49-421-200-3178, fax: +49-421-200-493178 > - Executive Director, rasdaman GmbH Bremen (HRB 26793) > www.rasdaman.com, mail: baum...@rasdaman.com > tel: 0800-rasdaman, fax: 0800-rasdafax, mobile: +49-173-5837882 > "Si forte in alienas manus oberraverit hec peregrina epistola incertis ventis > dimissa, sed Deo commendata, precamur ut ei reddatur cui soli destinata, nec > preripiat quisquam non sibi parata." (mail disclaimer, AD 1083) > >
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