Hi Simon, If Anne's hypothesis that your problems may be due to the upgrade CD are correct, this may be moot. But let me finish these answers.
On Dec 13, 2007, at 02:07AM, Simon Cavendish wrote: >No, I didn't have to enter my password in Tiger. The Macbook would just boot >and Voiceover would start. Unfortunately, if I remember correctly, I >off-loaded Voiceover with command+f5 before continuing with the installation >with my friend. After we finished the installation, the Mac presentation >started, and as it was already late, my friend came out of it but I actually >didn't check whether voceover was working. We just switched the machine off >after it had updated itself. I wish I had now. I was using my friend's >wireless connection to download and install the updates. OK, I think this probably means that you don't have to enter your password in Leopard, either. Maybe David or someone else can check me on this if I'm wrong, But I believe you may only have had to enter your password as Administrator to allow the update > >I think we must have booted into my account after the installation because >Leopard also updated itself and to install the update I had to enter my >password. But that's all. > >Just supposing for a minute that I do get the login screen, does it open >with the cursor in user name? Do I then press tab once in order to get into >password field? I suppose I could try this and see provided I know where the >cursor is located as the computer boots up. If there is only your one account on the machine, then when the login screen comes up, the cursor will be in the username field. When you press tab you should be taken to the password field. If these fields have text in them, you will need to hold down the delete key to clear your earlier entries. I'm afraid I may have generated confusion with my suggestion that the num lock setting might have been engaged by your inadvertantly pressing the F6 key, since I didn't realize at the time that you had checked the box to use software function key settings. > >Just a side question. I think I may have switched my Macbook off incorrectly >doing it blind so to speak, and now I cannot switch it off. Is there a way >of doing it blind, if only somewhat crude? > I think that I would not worry about this. It does occur to me that if you cannot now use the fast shutdown key sequence of control-command-option-eject, we will know that you have the num lock key set on. You can try pressing FN+F6 and seeing whether the control-command-option-eject now works to do a fast shutdown. Cheers, Esther >Simon >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Esther" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac OS X by >theblind" <[email protected]> >Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 11:50 AM >Subject: Re: SOS: can't get mu VO to work after upgrading to Leopard > > >> Dear Simon, >> >> On Dec 13, 2007, at 01:27AM, Simon Cavendish wrote: >>>Dear Esther, >>> >>>Do you think that after the installation as I described it, I may be being >>>presented with some kind of a welcome screen or option screen whichp >>>prevents me from using vo commands? Is there a login screen that comes up >>>first? What's single userr mode? >>> >>>Simon >> >> Let me ask you, if your installation of Leopard was completed, I assume >> that your friend left you with your machine running and in your account? >> Otherwise you could not tell that the volume and other hardware keys >> were working. >> >> If your installation is as you described, you could either have been left >> at >> the login screen, or with your system already logged on. >> >> Before your Leopard Upgrade did you need to enter a password to >> enter your system once you powered on your computer? If so, and >> you were left in the login screen, then you may need to enter your >> user name and password. >> >> David, and others. I don't remember. If VoiceOver was turned off before, >> and >> not turned on at boot up, does Simon have to log into his account first >> before >> he can activate VoiceOver? >> >> Simon, single user mode is one of various options for restarting the >> system >> from the CD. I don't think you need to use it here. I was asking the >> others >> whether in this mode, we could start VoiceOver using system default >> values, >> since then we would know how to begin. Apparently, the answer is that >> it is not clear this would help here. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Esther >> >>>----- Original Message ----- >>>From: "Esther" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>To: "General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac OS X by >>>theblind" <[email protected]> >>>Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 11:19 AM >>>Subject: Re: SOS: can't get mu VO to work after upgrading to Leopard >>> >>> >>>> Hi David and Simon, >>>> >>>> I think that Simon's situation is as he described yesterday --- a >>>> Leopard >>>> install was done by a sighted friend, but VoiceOver was turned off while >>>> this was performed, and he hasn't been able to bring it up. >>>> >>>> Additionally, there was some confusion on our part that he was not >>>> using the FN key to turn on VoiceOver on his Macbook. But this was >>>> because he had checked the Systems Preference Box to use Software >>>> settings for the function keys by default, and made this change before >>>> the update. >>>> >>>> Richie was, I think, trying to respond to my question about whether >>>> there >>>> was an easy way to get VoiceOver started at boot time --- perhaps by >>>> using the install disk (not to install, but to override) and boot into >>>> single user mode with default settings. Do you know whether we have >>>> some option like this? >>>> >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Esther >>>> >>>> On Dec 13, 2007, at 01:09AM, David Poehlman wrote: >>>>>What install path did you take? If you upgraded unless you are hanging >>>>>on >>>>>some screen, you should have gotten vo to talk by now. >>>>> >>>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>>From: "Simon Cavendish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>To: "General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac OS Xby >>>>>theblind" <[email protected]> >>>>>Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 5:21 AM >>>>>Subject: Re: SOS: can't get mu VO to work after upgrading to Leopard >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Dear Esther, >>>>> >>>>>I hear no boing sound when pressing fn+f6. The only fundction keys that >>>>>produce a sound is f9 f10 and f11 without pressing the fn key and f11 >>>>>will >>>>>produce a boing sound with or without pressing the fn key. >>>>> >>>>>I've tried starting vo presentation by presssing control+option+shift f8 >>>>>but >>>>>that hasn't started anything either. I've tried messing about with the >>>>>control+option+command left/right arrow and then arrow up but to no >>>>>avail. >>>>> >>>>>I still haven't been able to find anybody who could look at the screen >>>>>for >>>>>me. A friend promised he might be able to call later on this afternoon >>>>>if >>>>>I >>>>>haven't resolved the issue. I'm sorry to be such a bore. I've been using >>>>>computers for over 10 years, and here I am feeling like a silly child. >>>>>Bear >>>>>with me, guys. >>>>> >>>>>Simon >>>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>>From: "Esther" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>To: "General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac OS X >>>>>by >>>>>theblind" <[email protected]> >>>>>Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 1:07 AM >>>>>Subject: Re: SOS: can't get mu VO to work after upgrading to Leopard >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Dear Simon, >>>>>> >>>>>> Let's assume that you have a working VoiceOver installation, and >>>>>> that your Function keys are turned on to use software function instead >>>>>> of hardware function. If your volume is turned up (from pressing >>>>>> FN + F5) then when you press F6 you should hear a kind >>>>>> of "boing" sound (I think they call it "funk"). Press FN+F6 once. >>>>>> You should not hear any sounds at all. Now try pressing Command >>>>>> and F5. Does VoiceOver come on? If not, press FN+F6 a second >>>>>> time and try Command + F5 again. >>>>>> >>>>>> The "funk" sound occurs whether or not you have VoiceOver running. >>>>>> Please believe that it is unlikely you could have done anything to >>>>>> the VoiceOver installation. It's just a question of getting it >>>>>> properly >>>>>> started. And nothing that you've done isn't something someone >>>>>> else hasn't already had problems with already. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> >>>>>> Esther >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wednesday, December 12, 2007, at 02:31PM, "Richie Gardenhire" >>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>>>>>>The one thing I learned from that experience, to try those steps >>>>>>>Esther outlined; Leopard has audible cues that will indicate when >>>>>>>VoiceOver is turned on, given all things have been tried. Thanks >>>>>>>again, Esther. Richie Gardenhire, Anchorage, Alaska. >>>>>>>On Dec 12, 2007, at 3:18 PM, Esther wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dear Simon, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Is it possible that you pressed FN+num lock by mistake? The most >>>>>>>> likely things are: (1) you don't have the volume up high enough to >>>>>>>> hear the VoiceOver voice or (2) you accidentally managed to >>>>>>>> press the num lock (F6) key so that your keyboard is not sending >>>>>>>> the characters you expect. (Item 2 happened to Richie Gardenhire, >>>>>>>> and is a particular problem to be aware of if you press keys while >>>>>>>> VoiceOver is not running). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If you switched hardware and software functions for the Function >>>>>>>> keys. I think you need to press FN+F6 to toggle the num lock. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm sure there is no problem with your VoiceOver install. I think >>>>>>>> it is one of the two problems I mentioned above. Make sure you >>>>>>>> (now) use FN+F5 to put your MacBook at maximum speaker >>>>>>>> volume before you try anything else. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Esther >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Dec 12, 2007, at 02:10PM, Simon Cavendish wrote: >>>>>>>>> Dear Esther, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Tried it all to no avail. Before installing Leopard, I had changed >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> keyboard setting to desktop to avoid having to press the FN key all >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> time, and that setting seems to have been kept by leopard. I know >>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>> because when I press FN with the functions keys, I hear various >>>>>>>>> funny noises >>>>>>>>> which I recgonise as changing volume or brightness. I've tried >>>>>>>>> hitting the >>>>>>>>> f6 key but I don't know now whether it's on or off. I've tried >>>>>>>>> various >>>>>>>>> combinations and VO is still silent. Does it sound serious to you? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Simon >>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>>> From: "Esther" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>> To: "General discussions on all topics relating to the use of Mac >>>>>>>>> OS X by >>>>>>>>> theblind" <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 11:54 PM >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: SOS: can't get mu VO to work after upgrading to >>>>>>>>> Leopard >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Simon, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Remember that on a Macbook you need to hold down the FN key as >>>>>>>>>> well as >>>>>>>>>> the Command and F5 keys to get VoiceOver to start up. You may >>>>>>>>>> also want >>>>>>>>>> to hold down the F5 key on the Macbook for a while before turning >>>>>>>>>> on >>>>>>>>>> VoiceOver, since I think it's the hardware Volume up key on the >>>>>>>>>> Macbook. >>>>>>>>>> (The top row should be Escape, F1, F2, F3, F4, F5. ) >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The other possible gotcha if your VoiceOver was not turned on >>>>>>>>>> before your >>>>>>>>>> friend left is that you hit the F6 (num lock) key on the keyboard >>>>>>>>>> instead >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> F5. If so, try to press F6 again to toggle num lock off, and >>>>>>>>>> issue your >>>>>>>>>> command >>>>>>>>>> of FN+Command+F5 to turn on VoiceOver. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hope this helps. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Esther >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Wed December 12, 2007, at 01:42PM, Simon Cavendish wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> Dear All, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I've just installed Leopard on my new Macbook. it turned out that >>>>>>>>>>> it came >>>>>>>>>>> with Tiger installed, and leopard on a CD. So I've just had it >>>>>>>>>>> installed >>>>>>>>>>> with sighted assistance, as I'm not that experienced in VO yet. >>>>>>>>>>> All went >>>>>>>>>>> smoothly and my friend has gone now. But when I tried to get my >>>>>>>>>>> VO to >>>>>>>>>>> start with the usual combination of keys Command+f5 so that i >>>>>>>>>>> could use my >>>>>>>>>>> Macbook, nothing happens. Does anyone know what might have >>>>>>>>>>> happened? This >>>>>>>>>>> command worked perfectly well in tiger. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> S O S from desperate simon! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > > >
