On 10 December 2015 at 10:07, Donald Stufft <don...@stufft.io> wrote: > >> On Dec 9, 2015, at 3:56 PM, Robert Collins <robe...@robertcollins.net> wrote: >> >> On 10 December 2015 at 08:59, Ralf Gommers <ralf.gomm...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> And even modern pips >>>> can be told *not to call wheel*. >>> >>> >>> Isn't that something you can ignore? If the plan for pip anyway is to always >>> go sdist-wheel-install, why support this flag for a new build interface? >> >> Well, there's still debate about that. I think its waste and will piss >> developers off (heck, even in tox OpenStack folk find sdist too long >> and disable it routinely - we've added CI checks that sdist doesn't >> error to allow keeping the local developer workflow smooth). >> > > I’m in process of moving so I’m a bit scattered brained at the moment and I > don’t have the time to look into the specifics but if this is for the build > interface (vs the shim) then I don’t think we should support plain > ``install``. Opting into the new format should mandate the capability of > producing a wheel and then installing from that instead of being able to > directly install.
It is neither; Ralf was referring to the long term pip internals stuff. The new format does mandate wheel and does not support direct 'install', nor require building an sdist. > If we consider the setuptools/distutils era to be “Make it Work”, then we’re > now at “Make it Right”, making it fast can come later but sacrificing > correctness for speed isn’t something I think we should be doing and so speed > arguments (vs why it’s more correct to do X instead of Y) don’t matter much > to me. Developer speed is a correctness issue: this took ages to get my head fully around, but at the heart of it, there's a very narrow window between in-flow and breaking-flow and the reason developers care so much about latency of local operations is staying in-flow. Yes, there are a wide set of correctness issues to preserve, but if we can't do that and retain a certain minimum performance level, developers will route around us, and we'll be legislating things folk will ignore. The current interface, preserving develop, is sufficient for now, I was commenting in my mail on the longer term view that Ralf was suggesting: tl;dr - this whole sub-bit is not a subject for now. -Rob -- Robert Collins <rbtcoll...@hpe.com> Distinguished Technologist HP Converged Cloud _______________________________________________ Distutils-SIG maillist - Distutils-SIG@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/distutils-sig
