On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 12:13:43AM +0100, Simon Hobson wrote: [cut]
> > > Right now with Debian Jessie systemd must be installed to make the > > desktop anywhere near functional, but that is a result of packaging > > decisions by Debian ... > > I don't think it's so much a packaging decision by Debian, more a case of > what the upstream devs have done. The Debian decision was (AIUI) "we don't > have the resources to remove the crap" - not a decision to add it, just a > realisation that the project couldn't remove it with the time and resources > available. I'm sorry but it does not seem to me that the story went like you say. Debian deliberately decided to go for systemd, at a time when no tight systemd dependency existed anywhere in Debian. Please do not forget that the first versions of jessie (testing) were still using sysvinit by default, and none of the packages required systemd to be there. AFAIR there was no mention about the amount of resources needed to "remove the crap" as you say. There were instead specific and identifiable responsabilities by the Debian Project Leader and by the Technical Committee, who decided to ignore all the pressures to stay with sysvinit that came from the userbase and from the developers. Those decisions were not made on the basis of the amount of work needed to contain systemd (which became really a problem *after* Debian chose it as a default), but following an unspecified "need" to go for the best technical solution available on the market. Once systemd was declared the standard in Debian, packagers had to adapt to the new riff and to go all-in in supporting systemd. Those who didn't like it, resigned and moved elsewhere. The present is crap and the future is foggy, so there is no reason at all to mess up with the past as well... HND KatolaZ -- [ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ --- GLUG Catania -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ me [at] katolaz.homeunix.net -- http://katolaz.homeunix.net -- ] [ GNU/Linux User:#325780/ICQ UIN: #258332181/GPG key ID 0B5F062F ] [ Fingerprint: 8E59 D6AA 445E FDB4 A153 3D5A 5F20 B3AE 0B5F 062F ] _______________________________________________ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng