On 21/12/15 11:06, John Hughes wrote:
On 21/12/15 11:52, Rowland Penny wrote:
On 21/12/15 10:03, John Hughes wrote:
What I'm looking for is choice -- I want people who want systemd to
be able to run it, and people who dont want it to be able to use
sysvinit, openrc or upstart or whatever. At the moment things are
all fucked up because there is no long term alternative to the seat
management part of systemd and few people seem prepared to work on it.
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This is what people have been trying to get through to you, if you
run debain jessie, you 'HAVE' to use systemd whether you want to or not.
No, you don't. You do have to have systemd installed, and I'm not
sure why, but systemd does not have to be pid 1.
OK, systemd doesn't have to be pid1, but by your admission, you still
have to have it installed *even* if you don't want to, this is *not* choice!
Can you answer why a desktop relies on an init system, because I cannot.
Because systemd (or systemd-shim) does session management, and Gnome
didn't want to keep doing it (badly) themselves.
There are other ways of doing session management (actually I couldn't
give a flying fig if Gnome3 relies on systemd, I hate that mess as well)
I can understand why parts of the desktop rely on something like
udev, but this has now been subsumed by systemd.
No it hasn't. The source code for udev is in the same tree as
systemd, and they share some library functions, but udev still works
without systemd.
Can you explain how? if you try to download the source package for udev,
you will get the systemd source package.
If systemd had just been a replacement for sysv or upstart etc, then
there would not have been all the row about it, those that wanted to
use it could have and those that didn't, didn't have to, but no,
because of the way it is taking over the established way of doing
things, you are denied the free choice of what init system to use!
Assumes facts not in evidence.
Only because you seem to be ignoring the evidence, try setting up a
debian jessie system with a gui. Now open a terminal as root and run
'apt-get purge systemd* -y'
Just how much of your install will you have left?
Rowland
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