On 10/12/05, David Handy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, Oct 12, 2005 at 08:25:56PM -0600, Chuck Allison wrote: > > > > CS enrollments seem to be dropping drastically everywhere. Many > > factors probably are at fault (dot-com bust, off-shoring hype), but > > there seem to be others. One in particular is that so few HS > > graduates seem ready analytically to join in.. > > I noticed a profound shift occur at Glencoe High School... > ... > I asked how many of them wanted to > become engineers. I got zero responses. I was floored. > ... > Chuck, we are up against a more difficult problem than just making CS look > cool. CS is fun, of course, but it is also hard work, there is no disguising > that. If the rising generation doesn't have the work ethic, there is really > no substitute. > > In my experience, I noticed that among the successful American-born > engineering students, a significant number of them had been raised on farms, > > David H
chuck, david, yes, this is very disturbing indeed. as a society, i think we are definitely "falling behind." it's true that most HS grads are *not* ready for the rigors of engineering in college. i too, graduated HS in 1985 when it wasn't all that bad. when i completed grad school 10 years later, i did notice that the *majority* of graduate students in the CS dept were born overseas. it's not that we *don't* have the talent, but that they have been diverted elsewhere. sadly, i don't see this trend reversing anytime soon, and yes, this will make offshoring even more attractive to employers. i (mostly) joke that in 20 years from now, i'll be flipping burgers. i hope that it doesn't get to that point. if we lose our ability to innovate, that's the end of the US as we know it. this country is founded on innovation and hard work -- does this come from the farmland too? i feel that we are definitely losing the edge in everything science and math-oriented. people are not taking care of themselves... we are getting fat and lazy, letting other people do the dirty work for us. in a way, this applies to your argument. why should i do the hard work when someone else will do it for me (and more cheaply). we can only slow it down with wonderful tools like python. jeffrey elkner and other educators have seen better retention rates in their classes, but still, i don't want this to be just a stem in the tide. somehow, good-paying, hard-working, and smart need to be attractive to people as something that they want to be. we don't offshore our medical services right? there still need to be doctors; their presense is locally required. unfortunately, that isn't necessarily true for engineering. oh, and to answer your original inquiry, here's a link to CP4E: http://www.python.org/cp4e/ -- wesley - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "Core Python Programming", Prentice Hall, (c)2006,2001 http://corepython.com wesley.j.chun :: wescpy-at-gmail.com cyberweb.consulting : silicon valley, ca http://cyberwebconsulting.com _______________________________________________ Edu-sig mailing list Edu-sig@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/edu-sig
