Please don't send the thank messages on mailing list, reply only to
individual.
Anil
-----Original Message-----
From: Beauchemin, Bob [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2000 4:55 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: O/R Mapping Tools
As long as the subject has been brought up, what is anyone's opinion on
Persistence Power Tier? They make some amazing claims and seem to have
addressed most of the CMP concerns like facade pattern, data chunking,
stored procedure utilization, relationships, cache management and failover.
Opinions? War stories? The patent for parts of the architecture is on file
and accessible through the web and makes interesting reading.
IMHO, CMP entity beans don't seem all that useful without a cache
architecture to make it worthwhile to shuttle all that data back and forth
between database and middle tier, with the gobs of network roundtrips that
implies. Unless the EJB container has a better SQL engine than the RDBMS or
90% of the access is row-at-a-time (and, pre-relationship support,
table-at-a-time). Am I missing something obvious? Or are performance and
scalability not major concerns?
Bob Beauchemin
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-----Original Message-----
From: Chip Wilson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 1:48 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: O/R Mapping Tools
I've used it on three different projects. I don't have the ability to
support all the following claims right now - so take them for what they are;
unsupported opinions. TOPLink is bloated, overly-complex, and innapropriate
for an EJB architecture. The transaction API and implementation have to be
shoe-horned into a JTA environment. It doesn't support 2PC, or at least it
didn't a year ago. Debugging problems is a nightmare. Developing and
maintaining mappings takes longer than writing individual broker/mapper
classes for each persistent object. The ramp-up time for developers is
extremely long. TOPLink is really, really slow. The cache is useless in an
EJB environment. TOPLink is really expensive.
I have written, helped write, designed and used countless O/R frameworks in
C++, Smalltalk and Java. I even helped develop a commercial competitor to
TOPLink, but it is no longer supported.
In an EJB environment, I favor a minimalistic O/R framework with
broker/mapper classes that execute JDBC calls and map between the schema and
the domain model. Entity beans access the persistence framework through a
facade. I typically prefer to hard-code the mapping logic, as this is the
easiest to develop, learn and maintain. If you must do some sort of
meta-data-based mapper, keep it simple and allow the ability to do it
manually in specific brokers. A simple framework like this can be designed,
implemented and tested (minus all the individual broker classes) in 40
man-hours.
>From: "B. Flaumenhaft" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: Re: O/R Mapping Tools
>Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:55:20 -0800
>
>
>Can you give us some details? I'd be very interested to learn more. I
>looked at TOPLink some time ago and was very impressed by its feature
>set and customizability. It was simply too expensive, and I had some
>doubts about performance and the runtime model.
>
>Why should we run away?
>
>Thanks,
>Ben Flaumenhaft
>
>At 8:13 AM -0600 12/20/00, Chip Wilson wrote:
>>Run away from TOPLink as fast as you can. Run far away.
>>
>>>From: Thomas Bökamp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>Reply-To: A mailing list for Enterprise JavaBeans development
>>><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>Subject: O/R Mapping Tools
>>>Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 23:37:50 -0800
>>>
>>>Hi,
>>>
>>>Parts of my current work is to evaluate O/R Mapping Tools products. Is
>>>there
>>>such a thing a report to study different O/R Mapping Tools . Currently we
>>>are looking at Cocobase and Toplink. Can somebody help with the following
>>>questions:
>>>
>>>- Anybody know about Cccobase or Toplink the quality and Performance?
>>>- Any other O/R Mappers worth evaluate? Especially we would like to know
>>>if
>>>there is a product that the C++-part of the project can use too.
>>>
>>>Thanks in advance
>>>
>>>Thomas.
>>>
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>>
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>
>
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