How does anything about the CPSC have anything to do with subject topic?
-- Ken Javor Ph: (256) 650-5261 From: Mike Violette <[email protected]> Reply-To: ***** IEEE emc-pstc List ***** <[email protected]> Date: Wednesday, May 14, 2025 at 12:57 PM To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PSES] NFPA 79 section 12.6 Conductor Sizing Hello folks, Fresh news from our Trusty Administration. The paring continues: https://www.nealcohenlaw.com/fired?utm_source=brevo&utm_campaign=-Youre%20Fired-%20President%20Trump%20Fires%20CPSCs%203%20Democratic%20Commissioners&utm_medium=email&utm_id=10 Best Regards, Mike Violette 240-401-1388 [email protected] From: Ralph McDiarmid <[email protected]> Date: Wednesday, May 14, 2025 at 1:54 PM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PSES] NFPA 79 section 12.6 Conductor Sizing As guidance, NFPA70 (the NEC) refers to Supervised Installation and engineering supervision. It doesn’t both to define engineering supervision” formally, but in Article 240, “. . . licensed professional engineer engaged primarily in the design or maintenance of electrical installations” Sounds like a definition, but Article 100 needs to be expanded to include frequently-used terminology. It is often so much easier to apply the tables in NFPA documents and avoid engineering supervised alternative approaches. From: [email protected] <[email protected]> Sent: May 9, 2025 11:36 AM To: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: RE: [PSES] NFPA 79 section 12.6 Conductor Sizing Good engineering needs to consider all things relevant, and an inspector is guided by what’s written in NFPA including temperature limits on terminals like those on Listed circuit breakers and terminal strips. From: Richard Nute <[email protected]> Sent: May 8, 2025 4:30 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PSES] NFPA 79 section 12.6 Conductor Sizing Hi Brian: The difference is engineering versus inspection. Engineering says 90 C 18 AWG is okay for 14 amps. Inspection says 18 AWG (regardless of temperature rating) is okay for 7 amps (according to the standard). Inspector is not an engineer and cannot make a decision (accept) to use a higher temperature rated wire and higher current. You are stuck. Best regards, Rich From: Brian Kunde <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, May 8, 2025 2:12 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PSES] NFPA 79 section 12.6 Conductor Sizing I forgot to mention that my wiring in question is inside of a piece of Laboratory Equipment. At one of our customer sites, the instrument was inspected to the NFPA 79. But even the NFPA 70 echos what the NFPA 79 is stating. So if I use 18AWG hookup wire inside a piece of laboratory equipment, what wire gauge charts and OCP guide do I use? My NRTL inspector says we are good, but this field inspector says, No. 18AWG wire must only use a 7 amp OCP. Thanks for your considerations The Other Brian On Thu, May 8, 2025 at 4:58 PM John Woodgate <[email protected]> wrote: It looks like the NFPA needs to be updated to take account of these 90 C and 105 C rated wires. On 2025-05-08 21:47, Brian Kunde wrote: In the NFPA 79 section 12.6.1.2, it says that 18 AWG wire can be used for 5.6 amp or less circuits and have an overcurrent protector not exceeding 7 amps. This makes sense because in table 12.5.1, 18AWG wire is rated 7 amps for 60°C and 75°C wire. And, 5.6 amp is 80% of 7 amp, so all is understood. However, if we use 90°C 18AWG wire, according to table 12.5.1, it is rated 14 amps. So can we use a 14 amp overcurrent protector or are we still limited to the 7 amp? If so, what if we use 105°C 18AWG wire which is rated 18-20 amps (depending on the chart you use)? Can I use it with an even larger Overcurrent protector? Thanks so much. The Other Brian PS: Yes, I am having trouble with an inspector over this issue. This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to [email protected] All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ Website: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/ Instructions: https://ewh.ieee.org/soc/pses/list.html (including how to unsubscribe) List rules: https://pses.ieee.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/EM-PSTC-List-Rules.pdf For help, send mail to the list administrators: Mike Sherman at: [email protected] Rick Linford at: [email protected] For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher at: [email protected] To unsubscribe from the EMC-PSTC list, click the following link: https://listserv.ieee.org/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=EMC-PSTC&A=1 -- Best wishes John Woodgate RAYLEIGH Essex OOO-Own Opinions Only www.woodjohn.uk If something is true: * as far as we know - it's science *for certain - it's mathematics *unquestionably - it's religion Virus-free.www.avg.com This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. 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