I agree that the club is great for most people. And some would like more. I told AJ that there is always room for improvements. They don't have to be realy large steps. May be just small ones to start with. Like trying to get more people in and keeping them in. And then building on that. If we never improved on anything we would still be living in caves. Mark
--- In [email protected], "AJ DeMarzo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Andy; > > I appreciate your thoughts and enthusiasm, it's just what a good organization needs. Ten people like you could rule the world! (If you ever get that job would you see what you can do about fuel prices?) However from some of your sentences, I do feel that you may be misinterpreting my comments along with the feelings of a bunch of folks that have the thoughtfulness of expressing themselves. First, I realize that my choice to no longer associate myself with the EOC will not bring me any benefits. I don't expect any, never will and am not at all slighted by it and hope that I am not giving the impression that I am expecting something for nothing. My choice was for specific reasons, others have theirs and I hope that's finally cleared up. What you say is so true and you only get out of an org what you put in, but could it be that many who are not members feel that what is initially offered is just not enough? That would also be fine as you can't please everyone all of the time. (Also realize that some can only "participate" by their support of membership!) My contention is simply that when something is broken I like to ask what can be done to fix it. When it doesn't get fixed, for whatever reason, I see a missed opportunity for things to be better. Can I fix it? I don't know but if I tried it would only be to everyone's. In the case of the current type club I've noticed something broken for a long time. Others feel everything is fine and that's perfectly okay. I guess I just enjoy looking at things and thinking of how much better they can be and in the case of a business or a beneficial club that's something necessary for survival. That action is not a criticism of what's been accomplished unless the controlling management of the org interpret it in that way which is foolish and no benefit to anyone, supporter or not. I'm sure you would agree that it's difficult for one to always do everything correctly alone and without help. It would beg the question why read instructional books, visit health professionals, contact the police or fire department, accountant, city manager, etc. Incidentally, all the aforementioned folks stay on their game by participating in some type of recurrent training. Getting new ideas and help. > > So before anyone gets the impression that this is a discussion of criticism and an all around bashing of the current type club, you may want to go back, reread and expand your scope, because it's not. It's a healthy exchange of what I see that could be offered and available to YOU, the Ercoupe community. > > Whatever the outcome of this thread, my intentions are that it will be to the benefit of all! > > Happy New Year! > > Al DeMarzo > Visit the Ercoupe Swap Page - Free and Easy > http://www.ercoupeowners.com/swap/swapbook.htm > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Andy Anderson > To: 'AJ DeMarzo' > Cc: [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 10:35 AM > Subject: [ercoupe-flyin] RE: Type Club > > > > AJ DeMarzo and all other non EOC members, > > > > Mr. Tommy Terry infers a most valid point in his post. That being, you only get out of an organization what you put into it. Therefore if you are not an EOC member; if you do not receive the newsletter; and if you do not attend the annual EOC conventions; It appears to me that you are receiving just what you are should receive from EOC; Nothing in - nothing out. > > > > In my opinion, the Ercoupe community will never be of a size to support a fancy newsletter or the high dollar conventions. Personally, I prefer the grass roots type conventions that we have. I have attended most of the conventions over the past ten years. All have been enjoyable. The Minden convention was poorly organized but still enjoyable. The 2007 convention at Wayne Nebraska was well organized and very enjoyable. > > > > If you want to host a convention, then have at it and make it as fancy as you want. If you want to organize a simple Saturday lunch fly-out, then have at it. Just get involved instead of sitting on your duff on the sideline and throwing rocks at an organization you are not a member of. Also; if you want to organize your own type club, then have at it. Personally I think my efforts will be more effective if I work from inside EOC as a member. I am basically happy with EOC. I would like to see the newsletter in a different format instead of PDF and have made that recommendation. However; if the majority of members prefer PDF, then that is how it should be. > > > > The fantastic web site that is mentioned in Dan Hall's post: http://socal_wvaf.rvproject.com/ is the work of one individual by the name of Dan Check way, and is not the work of a type club. You could be that one individual who posts pictures of your Ercoupe projects. Or you could write an article for the newsletter. Or you could organize a fly-in... Or you can sit on your butt as a non- member and complain that no one is doing anything for YOU - your choice. > > > > Regards, > > Andy Anderson - EOC Member & Arkansas Wing Leader > > 415-D N93609 > > > > PS: Speaking of Dan Check way, I recommend his weather site: www.Weathermeister.com I use it before every cross country flight. > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------------------------- > > From: [email protected] [mailto:ercoupe- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of AJ DeMarzo > Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2007 11:29 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [ercoupe-flyin] Type Club > > > > Someone asked, I forgot who but when I reply to a post, I hit "Reply All" and then in the address columns I delete the individuals so they don't get doubles. > > > > Good site! Members fired up and willing to share! That's what we need. As far as what can be done, recognize the problem and suggest solutions. Remember I'm not a member of EOC. > > > > Al DeMarzo > Visit the Ercoupe Swap Page - Free and Easy > http://www.ercoupeowners.com/swap/swapbook.htm > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Dan Hall > > To: [email protected] ; Tommy Terry ; Dan Hall > > Cc: 'AJ DeMarzo' ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL > PROTECTED] > > Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2007 10:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [ercoupe-flyin] Type Club > > > > > > BTW - Here's an excellent example of an RV builders web site, as an example of what could be done for Ercoupe maintenance related information; http://socal_wvaf.rvproject.com/ There are MANY photos and related text to help describe various building tasks. > > > > I'm just putting this out there as an example of what can be done... > > Dan Hall > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Dan Hall > > To: [email protected] ; Tommy Terry > > Cc: 'AJ DeMarzo' ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL > PROTECTED] > > Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2007 7:56 PM > > Subject: Re: [ercoupe-flyin] Type Club > > > > Tommy, > > I absolutely agree with your observations. > > > > Mark, AJ, & Wayne, Ed, & all; > > That sounds like an excellent idea. If practical, building on or supplementing what already exists seems a far better option than fragmenting an already small and shrinking (!) group. > > > > I've put a lot of energy into Region 7 for the past 4 years trying to rally interest and participation, and the returns seem marginal at best (the help of one member has provided us with a web site for the region @ http://www.calcoupers.org/ ). > > > > Someone at the national level tasked with Government & regulatory affairs, to work with the FAA, EAA, and possibly the AOPA would seem to make the most sense. > > > > Who has the technical knowledge, is willing to do the work required, and perhaps has some governmental contacts already....? > > > > IMHO - We also very much need to continue Ed Burkhead's work by carefully documenting Coupe specific technical information and posting on the web for reference by all. It seems to me that rather basic things like detailed annual inspection information written to the level of a typical owner WITH PHOTOS would be a good start. Details regarding each of the AD's & STC's (again, with photos!) would be great, as would an index of maintenance & repair tasks such as correct re-rigging and other typical Ercoupe specific issues (all with PHOTOS). General info on things like the engine and accessories would be nice too. > > > > The Ercoupe Tech Gurus out there may not realize how many & import the tricks and "simple things" they know that would drive owners and even A&P's crazy, and how valuable their knowledge and insights are to the rest of us. > > > > Happy New Year and Best Regards, > > Dan Hall > > N3968H > > CNO > > Region 7 > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Tommy Terry > > To: [email protected] > > Cc: 'AJ DeMarzo' ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2007 7:47 PM > > Subject: [ercoupe-flyin] Type Club > > After reading the parts of this discussion that were on-list, I must agree that our type club may not be all that we might want it to be. > > Let's look at some of what I know our club does do: there is a monthly newsletter and an annual convention that come to light immediately. The not so obvious things might include a dedication to keeping our type in existence by providing an irreplaceable source of knowledge specific to our birds and the "momentum" that was mentioned in an earlier post. In addition to these tangible accomplishments; there is the scholarship dedicated to the memory of one of, if not the, greatest aeronautical engineers this country has known. > > Looking a little more deeply into these things: > > The scholarship is totally funded by donations made by our members at the annual convention. It may not be a Billion Dollar deal, but it is appreciated by the folks who receive it and it keeps the legacy of Mr. Fred Weick alive. > > The "momentum" of the type club does exist. Our leadership may not be setting the world on fire but they are keeping an eye on lots of things. A couple of years ago when the infamous SB32 came along, our leaders kept us informed of what was being found as long as we kept them informed. > > In the EOC we have a pool of knowledge that cannot be replaced; a lot of those folks also share that knowledge on these forums but the type club gives them a "formal" setting to work from when needed. > > Our newsletter and convention seem to come under fire fairly regularly and I must admit that there is room for improvement in each category. The 2008 convention promises to be great. Syd is working very hard to insure that a good time, as well as an educational time is had by all. 2009 should also be good if the folks at the convention center in Vicksburg are to be believed; and I think they are. > > The newsletter is probably the most visible part of our club and, yes, it can be a bit lame at times. Publishing a newsletter is tough work, especially when you have to depend on members of a club spread around the world to give you the information to publish. Even if every member sent something once per year it would still be hard to have new and interesting material. How much new can be written about an airframe design that is 60 years old when you've been writing every month for 30 years? > > Yes, there are organizations that have a really slick newsletter and a 'barn burner' of an annual convention, but those organizations have something ours doesn't: A paid staff. Our dues of $20 per year will not provide for the slick newsletters written by paid staff or filled with bought articles. The modest registration fees for the annual convention will not support the fancy conventions that some organizations have. > > I do not want to start a big ruckus and will not participate in anything less than civil debate. However; the EOC is not an entity of itself, WE are the EOC and if we want the club to be different, we need to re-direct it. Let's not throw the current or past leadership to the wolves. Rather, we should appreciate what they have done to keep the club intact and ready for the next 30 years. > > One last thought: Mr. C.W. Tackett, Scout Master of troop 7 had a saying, "You only get as much out of scouting as you put into it." If all we put into the Ercoupe Owner's Club is $20 per year, that's all we can expect out of it. If we want more; we must do more: write an article, send some photos, offer to hold the convention...... > > Tommy > > N93929 >
