EV Digest 4375
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Cable crimping
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Cable crimping
by mreish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Gear sprocket calculator.
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Cable crimping
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) EV weekend With Wayland, Rudman and Father TIme
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Renault leopard motor upgrade questions
by Phil Sobolik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Where is the best buy on ADC motors?
by mreish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: You need a welder (Weld or braze?)
by "Stu and Jan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Cable crimping
by "darren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) another S H O C K E R !!! An EV Convention
by Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Gear sprocket calculator.
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) Re: Hybrid kit?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Where is the best buy on ADC motors?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
17) Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
18) Re: Another Newbie Charging Question
by "J.R. Young" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
by "darren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: PFC20 Charging Questions
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
At 12:13 AM 5/21/2005, Philippe Borges wrote:
Whitout tools there is another solution:
buy the hammer crimper BUT use it under a press.
You should find one to use just about 10mn (all cable ready to crimp) for
free at any big mechanics shop around.
i mix both solution because i have tolls and i made my press crimper,
crimping is very effective under 30 000kg force :^)
I just use my Big Bench Vise. Seems to work quite well.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.electroauto.com/catalog/tools.shtml
I'd just use one of those hammer style crimpers like in the picture.
I have one of these hammer style crimpers but I toss it into an arbor
press. That way I can crimp into the wee hours of the morning without
irritating my wife. I'm using smallish cable on my motorcycle but I
wonder how well it would work on bigger stuff.
--
The Electric Motorcycle Portal
http://www.electricmotorcycles.net/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 21 May 2005 08:06:47 +0100, spidercats
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>http://www.arachnoid.com/bike/index.html
>
>It's for bicycles but works with reduction gears as well.
>
>Matt G
>
If you use a PalmPilot, this little freebie utility does gear ratios
nicely
http://www.micoks.net/~dbennett/ps.html
John
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 21 May 2005 10:06:00 -0400, mreish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>http://www.electroauto.com/catalog/tools.shtml
>>
>>I'd just use one of those hammer style crimpers like in the picture.
>
>I have one of these hammer style crimpers but I toss it into an arbor
>press. That way I can crimp into the wee hours of the morning without
>irritating my wife. I'm using smallish cable on my motorcycle but I
>wonder how well it would work on bigger stuff.
I converted my hammer crimp to a press crimp by welding up a small
frame to go around an 8 ton bottle jack. Compact and portable.
I also had great success before that by drilling a suitable hole in
the top of the hammer crimp that a blunt bit from an air hammer would
fit into.
John
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Along these lines , I have a friend who uses 4 to 6 golf cart batteries as a
welder , I was very impressed with it when I tried it out. He has some long
no 12 wire on a board that's used to cut back the current , taps in where he
needs it , . This is stick welding very simple and as you say in a hour you
can learn .
Steve Clunn
----- Original Message -----
From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 1:27 AM
Subject: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
At 09:11 PM 5/20/2005, you wrote:
$21 if you have the the rest of the tools you used to make the tools....
like a welder, fer instance...
just sayin....
If you are doing a conversion, you really need to have access to a
MIG welder (or at least a flux-core welder).
It is very difficult to do a conversion without a welder. Folks do
it, but they typically pay more than the price of a welder to have the
welding done for them.
MIG welding is ridiculously simple to do. Can you use a hot glue
gun without burning yourself? If so, you can MIG weld. Folks act like
welding is some mystical black art, and only the "anointed ones" that have
the elusive "welding genes" are allowed to operate the sacred welding
equipment.
I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
You can get set up to MIG weld for a few hundred dollars.
_ /| Bill "Wisenheimer" Dube'
\'o.O' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
=(___)=
U
Check out the bike -> http://www.KillaCycle.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
Posted for Tim Brehm, who's having a hard time getting onto the EVDL:
>
> Hello to everyone. This is my first post ever written. Wayland has been
> bugging me
> to sign up for the list for awhile now, so here I am. I have been working on
> industrial
> EVs for almost seven years
> now. I work for the same forklift company that John does. I have also been
> helping John
> with various EV projects around the Wayland backyard laboratory for about the
> last year.
> I mostly just perform the
> grunt work that he doesn't want to do. However, This past weekend was an
> exception, he
> was scrambling to reassemble the Blue Meanie for a car show on Saturday. This
> poor car
> has been sitting around
> with stereo, console, E-meters and various other stuff spread out all over
> the EV shop
> for at least a month. We also had a trip planned to go to central Oregon to
> check on the
> 13" motor and the new siamese
> 8" motor progress on Friday and did I mention the Blue Meanie did not even
> have a
> controller in it! Sounds like it's going to be a long weekend. It all started
> on
> Thursday after work I headed to Johns house
> when I showed up he was already installing the new Z1K in the big empty space
> where the
> Raptor was. The Zilla is only about half the size, now the 9" motor just
> jumps out at
> you now. With the Zilla
> mounted and John working on the new control wiring I started measuring the
> enclosures
> for the 4 new JL audio 8s going in the rear dash. Here is where the problems
> start.
> After measuring the enclosure
> and doing the math we needed one more cubic foot of air space for the
> enclosure in the
> already limited space of the trunk, to make matters worse the new JLs are
> about an inch
> deeper than the previous subs.
> We decided to call it a night. 5:30 AM Friday morning I headed back to the
> Wayland house
> to get a little more work done on the car before the trip to central Oregon.
> When I
> arrived John was just finishing
> the wiring and was already hungry again (those of you who know John know what
> I'm
> talking about). He handed me a sawzall and a drill and told me to make the
> new speakers
> fit. I could tell this was
> another job he didn't want to do, just the thought of cutting up this
> beautiful car was
> making him sick. Now with John locked out of the shop before he changes his
> mind, I went
> to work cutting up the Blue
> Meanie to make room for the new subs!! Even though a new enclosure with allot
> more
> volume will be needed I installed the new speakers. With much more work still
> needed on
> the car I don't think John
> could take the four giant hole straight into the trunk, they will have to be
> free air
> subs for this show, due to the time limit. Now, John is returning from his
> breakfast I
> quickly retract the motorized battery
> tray and close the trunk, explaining "we don't have the time for subs now we
> don't even
> know if the car goes". After a quick check of all the new wiring the car is
> ready for a
> much needed charge with the
> PFC 20 under the hood. After cleaning the shop a bit John and I were just
> standing back
> and admiring the new, even cleaner look under the hood and the blue LED on
> the charger
> here comes Rich Rudman,
> it's almost like he was listening for his queue. After a couple of intense
> conversations
> with Rudman, Father Time showed up (I don't know his real name, but Father
> Time fits
> very well) . After hitching the
> trailer to the Jeep we were all on our way to central Oregon, after breakfast
> of course.
> The trip to Redmond was uneventful, not the typical Wayland trip. We arrived
> at the
> motor shop at around 1:30 checked
> progress on the motors for about ten minutes and then had to leave for a
> lunch meeting
> with The Dutchmen crew to figure out some drive train issues on the mini
> truck project.
> The 13" motor, Z2K and a
> brand new pack of Orbitals could probably take out a drive axle pretty quick!
> After
> lunch we all returned to the motor shop. When we returned Jim was still hard
> at work
> assembling the giant motor,
> installing the new field coils. Rudman and I started gathering and cleaning
> various
> motor parts to speed up the assembly of the motor, when Father Time pulls out
> these huge
> very shiny disc type objects.
> WOW! The new aluminum end plates for the 13" motor he had made at home. He
> took some
> quick measurements off the motor housing, chucked one of these discs into the
> lathe and
> went to work on the
> finishing touches. After several hours at the motor shop it was time to load
> the mini
> truck on the trailer and go home. The huge motor was not done baking when we
> left and
> there is still allot of suspension
> and drive train work to do on the mini truck, so we were not concerned with
> bringing the
> motors home this weekend. besides this gives Jim more time to work his magic
> on both the
> motors. The trip home
> was uneventful too (and this is starting to get pretty long). 7:00 AM
> Saturday morning
> John is in his usual "Wayland panic mode" before the show. Only two hours
> until we have
> to be there "so much stuff
> to do we're not going to make it". The Blue Meanie has not even been tested
> yet! With
> John installing the console and finishing touches to the interior me and
> Father Time
> were unloading the mini truck off
> the trailer to make room for Blue Meanie. We enter the EV shop just in time
> to see John
> hop into the car for a trial run, the weird thing was he wasn't smiling,
> usually his
> eyes light up when he even looks at
> this car. Father Time and I just stood back and watch him back out of the
> driveway with
> the stressed scowl on his face. we were concerned about the look on his face
> wondering,
> what did he blow up this
> time? He took off down the road with tires squealing until we lost sight of
> him. After
> about ten minutes came rolling silently up the road. John jumps out of the
> car "I forgot
> how much fun this little car is"
> with the EV grin he lost about a month ago on his face. With the new Zilla
> working
> perfect and no melted wiring or zorch marks, the car was loaded onto the
> trailer for the
> trip to the show. We arrived at the
> car show almost on time. We parked a couple of blocks away, all three of us
> loaded into
> the Blue Meanie and we drove through the gates with all the classic muscle
> cars. There
> was a large group of people
> around the car all day. Nobody even noticed the sub enclosure wasn't finished
> and the
> other minor details that hadn't been dealt with due to the time restraints.
> Everyone
> love the cute clean little car. The
> show started winding down so we decided it was time to leave. While leaving,
> with the
> sounds of loud exhaust and huge engines all around us, everyone had their
> eyes on this
> little blue car, silently cruising
> toward the exit gate. John could not resist, all those eyes on his car
> doubting that
> little electric motor they had been staring at all day, he had to let just a
> little
> smoke out of the tires on the way through the
> gate. The crowd went wild!!
>
> Tim Brehm
> >
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Does this mean that I can just add batteries to my stock Leopard and maybe
get up some of these Massachusetts hills at faster than 20 MPH? It looks
like you're putting 102V into a 48V motor. Or is the controller stepping
it down to 48V?
Phil Sobolik
At 08:09 PM 5/20/2005 -0700, you wrote:
Thanks Jerry,
Existing motor burned up and I have long, long ago taken this Leopard
far away from stock. The only things left that are stock are the rear
brakes and running gear, the transmission and the basic body.
The front seats are soon to be replaced with something more comfortable,
the body has been tweaked, the dash is aluminum (ala racing style) and
all the guages replaced with all electronic stuff, the old contactor
controller and 48 volt arrangement and Lester transformer style charger
was gone within a few months after I bought it..(years ago). It's 102V,
PFC20, Curtis 1231, SurePower DC/DC, Dakota Digital Speedo, E-Meter,
stereo... you get the picture, if not, here's the link to it.... :-)
www.notebene.net/ev/lektron.html
Tony
jerry dycus wrote:
Hi Tony and All,
Why are you changing the motor? It's not really
worth it and the EV works very well just as it is
other than doing a better battery hold down system,
new batt charger. Save the original parts to restore
it to stock in the future.
<snip>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVparts.com has a little better website, but it is starting to get out
of date. There have been some mutterings that support/inventory for
Don't forget the Cloud brothers at cloudelectric.com - later on the web than
WildeEvolutions/EVParts, but sometimes that means you get to see the other
guys' mistakes and avoid them.
But sometimes not.
Pardon me for getting a rip and this is not aimed at any one retailer:
I think the state of EV/Web commerce is pretty bad. Between sites
that are hard to navigate, rarely if ever updated, difficult to order
through and just plain ugly, I'm amazed they've found the ROI to keep
them going. Am I the only one who gathers information, or tries to
actually, before placing an order by browsing catalogs weather they
be old fashioned print catalogs or online? Am I the only one who's
NOT purchased parts because the only way to do so was by an insecure
form or worse, an email link? Am I the only one who dreads getting a
phone call two days after an order is placed saying the parts are no
longer carried?
Come on guys. It's 2005 and time to get your sites out of 1995.
Mike
--
The Electric Motorcycle Portal
http://www.electricmotorcycles.net/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Weld or braze?
I like to braze. Brazing temperature is lower than welding and there is
less heat stress. The brazing temperature flame color is not eye damaging.
You can clearly see what you are doing without having to wear dark glasses.
Fillet brazing can fill uneven joints. Brazing joints are very strong and
they are more flexible than welding joints. Many race cars are brazed.
Oxygen/propane is very cheap. (Fuji bicycles are o/p brazed.) You can also
use it to solder lug joints with o/p. Can't do that with a MIG welder.
My .02
YMMV
BoyntonStu
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 2:27 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
At 09:11 PM 5/20/2005, you wrote:
>$21 if you have the the rest of the tools you used to make the tools....
>like a welder, fer instance...
>just sayin....
If you are doing a conversion, you really need to have access to a
MIG welder (or at least a flux-core welder).
It is very difficult to do a conversion without a welder. Folks do
it, but they typically pay more than the price of a welder to have the
welding done for them.
MIG welding is ridiculously simple to do. Can you use a hot glue
gun without burning yourself? If so, you can MIG weld. Folks act like
welding is some mystical black art, and only the "anointed ones" that have
the elusive "welding genes" are allowed to operate the sacred welding
equipment.
I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
You can get set up to MIG weld for a few hundred dollars.
_ /| Bill "Wisenheimer" Dube'
\'o.O' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
=(___)=
U
Check out the bike -> http://www.KillaCycle.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I use mine on 4 gauge works great so far.
had local shop do 2/0 with one before I bought mine, also worked great
Thank You
................................
www.12voltguy.com
SeaBass44/~Darren
----- Original Message -----
From: "mreish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 7:06 AM
Subject: Re: Cable crimping
>http://www.electroauto.com/catalog/tools.shtml
I'd just use one of those hammer style crimpers like in the picture.
I have one of these hammer style crimpers but I toss it into an arbor
press. That way I can crimp into the wee hours of the morning without
irritating my wife. I'm using smallish cable on my motorcycle but I
wonder how well it would work on bigger stuff.
--
The Electric Motorcycle Portal
http://www.electricmotorcycles.net/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
RIGHT UNDER OUR NOSE, AND I JUST GOT WIND OF IT TODAY !!
First: Here is my RESPONSE E-Mail:
Dear Mr. Opperman:
When first I scanned the e-mail and the FAX you so graciously sent us, I
thought " ..Seattle Electric Vehicle ....." !!! Holy Cow, some one has
stolen our name !! After a quarter of a century of work in this field ..
But then... I soon realized the validity of the whole name, and the
scope of the conference.
Strange we have not met. I know, or know of.. most all your Forum
invitees.
The Seattle Electric Vehicle Association is at your service, and would
be honored to add the "local perspective" to the conference, and to
discuss the progress and the problems we have encountered over the last
quarter century..
Till then...
Respectfully:
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -- -
And HERE is the TEXT of their Press Release:
Key National Experts on Electric Vehicle to Grid Applications to Speak
in Seattle
Sustainable Ballard's
Alliance of Sustainable Alternatives to Petroleum (ASAP)
Presents:
"The Seattle Electric Vehicle to Grid Forum"
Community activists of the non-profit Sustainable Ballard believe that
Washington State is strategically poised to lead the nation in the
development, manufacture and implementation of renewable energy
technologies that will help wean our economy from its addictive dependence
on non-renewable and dwindling carbon resources such as coal and oil.
Clean, renewable energy is clearly this country's future. We can spearhead
it right here in Washington state.
Day One
"Technical Symposium on Vehicle To Grid Power"
Monday, June 6, 2005, 1:00pm to 4:30pm, Bertha Landes Room, City Hall,
Seattle WA 600 Fourth Avenue South (entrance on Fifth Avenue)
A panel of experts will thoroughly cover vehicle-to-grid power at a
technical level. Planned topics include: comparison of plug-in hybrid
with battery vehicles, new sources of clean power in the Pacific
Northwest, modular factories for small-volume vehicle manufacturing, the
economics of V2G to support renewable energy policy and implementation
strategies, and a brief hands-on tutorial for calculating basic V2G power
and price
parameters. The presentations will be interspersed with questions and
discussion with the audience.
Day Two
"The Seattle Electric Vehicle to Grid Enterprise (V2G)"
Tuesday, June 7, 2005, 1:00pm to 4:30pm, Bertha Landes Room, City Hall,
Seattle WA 600 Fourth Avenue South (entrance on Fifth Avenue)
This panel will bring together experts who can present exciting scenarios
in which we engage and deploy the manufacturing resources and
highly-trained workforces already in place here in the Pacific Northwest.
This panel advocates "connecting utility infrastructure with automobiles"
for the eventual creation, marketing and manufacturing of Vehicle to Grid
(V2G) in Seattle.
This forum is sponsored by Climate Solutions, Seattle City Light and
Sustainable Ballard.
Forum invitees include:
Steve Nicholas, Director, City of Seattle's Office of Sustainability and
Environment. Steve Nicholas works to increase the environmental
sustainability of City operations and services, and to accelerate the
adoption of those practices in Seattle-area businesses, households, and
neighborhoods. In the early 1990s, Steve co-founded Sustainable Seattle,
a nonprofit organization promoting sustainability awareness and action.
He currently serves on the Governor's Sustainable Washington Advisory
Panel. <http://www.ci.seattle.wa.us/environment>
http://www.ci.seattle.wa.us/environment
Jorge Carrasco, Seattle City Light, Superintendent. Jorge Carrasco brings
a unique combination of insight and more than 30 years experience in the
management of a large city energy utility. Jorge's vision is focused on
the needs of our energy future and the role renewables play in meeting
those challenges. He is responsible for Seattle City Light's commitment to
emit zero net greenhouse gas emissions. http://
<http://www.ci.seattle.wa.us/light> www.ci.seattle.wa.us/light
Panel Moderator, Patrick Mazza, Climate Solutions Research Director.
Patrick Mazza is a veteran journalist and accomplished environmental
reporter and activist, who leads the research and authoring of Climate
Solutions' special reports and publications. Patrick co-authored the book
"Stormy Weather: 101 Solutions to Climate Change" and coordinated the
Green Party's global climate position statement to the December 1999 Kyoto
Climate Summit, endorsed by 65 Green parties on six continents.
<http://www.climatesolutions.org/> http://www.climatesolutions.org
Dr. Willett Kempton, Associate Professor and Senior Policy Scientist at
the University of Delaware. Dr. Willett Kempton is the innovator of the
electric vehicle-to-grid (V2G), the concept of connecting vehicles to
allow two-way electrical flow to the power grid. He has developed the
concept, equations and market analysis in a series of publications and
research, with students, colleagues and engineers, funded by utilities and
public agencies. His education combines electrical engineering, computer
science and anthropology. His career spans 35 years experience in energy
systems, environmental analysis, and technology policy. His two current
research, speaking, and publishing foci are V2G and offshore wind power
(see <http://www.udel.edu/V2G> www.udel.edu/V2G and
<http://www.ocean.udel.edu/WindPower> www.ocean.udel.edu/WindPower).
Tom Gage, President, AC Propulsion Inc. AC Propulsion manufactures
electric vehicle propulsion systems and develops world leading
vehicle-to-grid technology. AC propulsion electric vehicles can source or
sink grid power at up to 20 kW.. The AC Propulsion,tZero is an electric
sports car that out-accelerates a Lamborghini, but is more efficient than
a Honda Insight. <http://www.acpropulsion.com/>
http://www.acpropulsion.com
Dr. Mark Duvall, Electric Transportation Technology Development Manager at
EPRI (Electric Power Research Institute), a non-profit organization whose
mission is to provide collaborative science and technology solutions for
the electric power industry. Dr. Duvall conducts research and technology
development efforts in advanced transportation, including hybrid system
design, advanced energy storage, vehicle efficiency, systems modeling, and
environmental analysis. His primary focus is plug-in hybrid electric
vehicles and he oversees a number of EPRI research partnerships and
collaborations with the automotive industry, state and federal agencies,
national laboratories, and academic research institutions. He currently
heads up EPRI's Grid-Connected Hybrid Electric Vehicle Working Group
(HEVWG) and is EPRI's technical lead for the Daimler Chrysler-EPRI Plug-in
Hybrid Electric Sprinter Van Program. <http://www.epri.com/>
http://www.epri.com
Space is limited to 275 each day. To attend, you must RSVP and receive
confirmation. Please email us your name, company or organization, phone
number, address and which day(s) you will attend to
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [EMAIL PROTECTED] by May 31st.
Invitations to participate in upcoming "Alliance of Sustainable
Alternatives to Petroleum" (ASAP) quarterly forums are being extended to
Trade Unions, investors, representatives of local, state, and federal
government; utility companies; and small, medium and large renewable
energy companies and is open to the general public.
ASAP is an educational outreach project of the non-profit organization
Sustainable Ballard (Washington). <http://www.sustainableballard.org/>
http://www.sustainableballard.org "The Future of Ballard Is To Make the
Future Its Business"
Contacts for Event:
Vic Opperman, Co-Director, Sustainable Ballard/ ASAP, 206.789.7646,
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Mark Wilson, Sustainable Ballard/ ASAP 360.440.2576,
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
--
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 12:27 AM 5/21/05 -0600, you wrote:
At 09:11 PM 5/20/2005, you wrote:
$21 if you have the the rest of the tools you used to make the tools....
like a welder, fer instance...
just sayin....
If you are doing a conversion, you really need to have access to
a MIG welder (or at least a flux-core welder).
Sorry, Bill. This sentence will put a whole lot of people off the idea of
doing a conversion. In fact, the reason we sell so many Voltsrabbit and
Voltsporsche kits is because a lot of people DO NOT want to have to do any
welding. Or design. Just plug and play.
It is very difficult to do a conversion without a welder. Folks
do it, but they typically pay more than the price of a welder to have the
welding done for them.
MIG welding is ridiculously simple to do. Can you use a hot glue
gun without burning yourself? If so, you can MIG weld. Folks act like
welding is some mystical black art, and only the "anointed ones" that
have the elusive "welding genes" are allowed to operate the sacred
welding equipment.
I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
And how good were those welds? Do you really want to trust your life to
them in a collision? There's a story about WWII submarines. The welders
would get into a hurry, trying to get the things out the door. The welds
LOOKED good, but they weren't. They failed and leaked. Not a good thing
in a submarine. Then they started taking the welding crews down on the
maiden voyages. The quality of the welds improved immensely. Can your 7th
graders reliably recognize a bad weld?
Mike can weld, too. But he feels it is well worth the price to pay a very
talented, experienced fellow to weld up our battery racks, because this guy
really KNOWS what he's doing. No "bubble gum" welds here.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> http://www.arachnoid.com/bike/index.html
>
> It's for bicycles but works with reduction gears as well.
>
> Matt G
Another bike ste, more aimed at energy use:
http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/espeed.htm
Also nice to see what the BMI (body mass index) of the rider is!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> That has to be the funniest Ebay auction I've seen in a long time.
>
> I should put up an auction.
>
> Title: EV
> Opening Price: $13,000
> Body: <h8>Really good EV for sale</h8>
>
> :)
>
Item has some info now:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4551426025
Appears he's into contactor control of an aircraft generator.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
yeah, batteries make a good welding power source. Adding a series
inductor makes the arc much smoother and less likely to stick. 50 to
75 turns of heavy wire around a 3" core, iron is optional, helps a
lot. I use old motor stators as a torodial inductor core. One can
get 20-30 turns of #4 or even #2 wire with thin insulation (THHN, for
example) in the core.
Major projects like ship building and power plant construction use
central power supplies. Typically 70 volt and up to 10,000 amps.
This is bussed around the site on heavy, usually bare cable suspended
on insulators. The welder clips onto the bus with his personal
current regulator. This is a small box containing a carbon pile and
an inductor. He just dials up the amount of current he wants.
With three phase in to the central supply the ripple is minimal. The
weld is almost as smooth as with a battery. The only welder I've ever
used that rivals a battery supply is the old Lincoln or Miller
dynamotor welders.
John
On Sat, 21 May 2005 07:42:18 -0500, "STEVE CLUNN"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Along these lines , I have a friend who uses 4 to 6 golf cart batteries as a
>welder , I was very impressed with it when I tried it out. He has some long
>no 12 wire on a board that's used to cut back the current , taps in where he
>needs it , . This is stick welding very simple and as you say in a hour you
>can learn .
>Steve Clunn
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: <[email protected]>
>Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 1:27 AM
>Subject: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
>
>
>> At 09:11 PM 5/20/2005, you wrote:
>>>$21 if you have the the rest of the tools you used to make the tools....
>>>like a welder, fer instance...
>>>just sayin....
>>
>> If you are doing a conversion, you really need to have access to a
>> MIG welder (or at least a flux-core welder).
>>
>> It is very difficult to do a conversion without a welder. Folks do
>> it, but they typically pay more than the price of a welder to have the
>> welding done for them.
>>
>> MIG welding is ridiculously simple to do. Can you use a hot glue
>> gun without burning yourself? If so, you can MIG weld. Folks act like
>> welding is some mystical black art, and only the "anointed ones" that have
>> the elusive "welding genes" are allowed to operate the sacred welding
>> equipment.
>>
>> I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
>>
>> You can get set up to MIG weld for a few hundred dollars.
>>
>>
>> _ /| Bill "Wisenheimer" Dube'
>> \'o.O' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> =(___)=
>> U
>> Check out the bike -> http://www.KillaCycle.com
>>
>>
>
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
> But sometimes not.
>
> Pardon me for getting a rip and this is not aimed at any one retailer:
>
> I think the state of EV/Web commerce is pretty bad. Between sites
> that are hard to navigate, rarely if ever updated, difficult to order
> through and just plain ugly, I'm amazed they've found the ROI to keep
> them going. Am I the only one who gathers information, or tries to
> actually, before placing an order by browsing catalogs weather they
> be old fashioned print catalogs or online? Am I the only one who's
> NOT purchased parts because the only way to do so was by an insecure
> form or worse, an email link? Am I the only one who dreads getting a
> phone call two days after an order is placed saying the parts are no
> longer carried?
>
> Come on guys. It's 2005 and time to get your sites out of 1995.
>
> Mike
>
I've never bought anything from any EV retailer, just use their sites to get
product info and prices (navigating them may be related to familiarity, not
layout), but it would certainly behoove any internet site to integrate secure
ordering and payment.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 5/21/05 11:02:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
Date: 5/21/05 11:02:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Electro Automotive)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
At 12:27 AM 5/21/05 -0600, you wrote:
>At 09:11 PM 5/20/2005, you wrote:
>>$21 if you have the the rest of the tools you used to make the tools....
>>like a welder, fer instance...
>>just sayin....
>
> If you are doing a conversion, you really need to have access to
> a MIG welder (or at least a flux-core welder).
Sorry, Bill. This sentence will put a whole lot of people off the idea of
doing a conversion. In fact, the reason we sell so many Voltsrabbit and
Voltsporsche kits is because a lot of people DO NOT want to have to do any
welding. Or design. Just plug and play.
> It is very difficult to do a conversion without a welder. Folks
> do it, but they typically pay more than the price of a welder to have the
> welding done for them.
>
> MIG welding is ridiculously simple to do. Can you use a hot glue
> gun without burning yourself? If so, you can MIG weld. Folks act like
> welding is some mystical black art, and only the "anointed ones" that
> have the elusive "welding genes" are allowed to operate the sacred
> welding equipment.
>
> I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
And how good were those welds? Do you really want to trust your life to
them in a collision? There's a story about WWII submarines. The welders
would get into a hurry, trying to get the things out the door. The welds
LOOKED good, but they weren't. They failed and leaked. Not a good thing
in a submarine. Then they started taking the welding crews down on the
maiden voyages. The quality of the welds improved immensely. Can your 7th
graders reliably recognize a bad weld?
Mike can weld, too. But he feels it is well worth the price to pay a very
talented, experienced fellow to weld up our battery racks, because this guy
really KNOWS what he's doing. No "bubble gum" welds here.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979 >>
I to know how to mig and tig weld since its part of my job.I repair welders
for a living and half of the service calls I preform on welding equiptment are
Operator error. Theres a select few folks
that I allow to weld on the Current Eliminator.
Dennis Berube 4000+ SAFE qt.mile runs in an ev
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee,
It is set at 90... but I don't believe that's the (main) problem. It
doesn't even come close to returning all the Ah used, it returned about 8ah
vs the 30ah removed. I'm pretty sure I have the PFC-20 voltage trim set
too low. I have it set to start the shut off timer when the voltage reaches
139. Even after discharging the pack about 20% to 30%, it hits 140 volts
the second I turn on the charger. So it doesn't spend ANY time in the main
charge cycle, it just spends 90 minutes at 5 amps and less.
So I think the question is, when my PFC-20 is in the main charge cycle
(charging at 19.5 amps), what target voltage should I be aiming for to start
the shut off timer? I don't think it's 138.5 as I have it set for now, it
must be higher than that.
My pack details:
22 x 6v Exide 3600 (Sam's Club Batteries)
Thanks!
Glenn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: Another Newbie Charging Question
> J.R. Young wrote:
> > My concern is that it seems like I'm taking a lot more OUT of the
batteries than I'm putting back in... Anybody have any suggestions?
>
> What is the E-meter's CEF (Charge Efficiency Factor) set for? The
> default is 90%, which means the E-meter expects you to put in an extra
> 10% to reach "full". Suppose it reads -100ah after a drive; if you
> charge 10 hours at 10 amps = 100ah, the meter only counts 90% of this,
> or 90ah; thus the E-meter still indicates -10ah. You have to put in
> 111ah to have the meter reach 100% and start blinking the "fully
> charged" indicator.
>
> With AGMs or gels, or with new flooded batteries, the actual CEF is
> higher; so the E-meter will lead you to overcharge them unless you set
> the CEF lower, or overcharge anyway so the E-meter will recalculate CEF
> by itself. If you reset the E-meter manually, or don't change the CEF
> manually to what it really is, the E-meter will never recalculate CEF
> and the problem will continue.
> --
> "Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
> citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
> has!" -- Margaret Mead
> --
> Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Buying a welder & laying a few beads in an houre does not make that person a
""welder"".....LOL
you stick to the 7th grade girl welders:-)
Thank You
................................
www.12voltguy.com
SeaBass44/~Darren
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 11:47 AM
Subject: Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
In a message dated 5/21/05 11:02:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: You need a welder (was: Cable crimping)
Date: 5/21/05 11:02:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Electro Automotive)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
At 12:27 AM 5/21/05 -0600, you wrote:
>At 09:11 PM 5/20/2005, you wrote:
>>$21 if you have the the rest of the tools you used to make the tools....
>>like a welder, fer instance...
>>just sayin....
>
> If you are doing a conversion, you really need to have access to
> a MIG welder (or at least a flux-core welder).
Sorry, Bill. This sentence will put a whole lot of people off the idea of
doing a conversion. In fact, the reason we sell so many Voltsrabbit and
Voltsporsche kits is because a lot of people DO NOT want to have to do any
welding. Or design. Just plug and play.
> It is very difficult to do a conversion without a welder. Folks
> do it, but they typically pay more than the price of a welder to have
> the
> welding done for them.
>
> MIG welding is ridiculously simple to do. Can you use a hot glue
> gun without burning yourself? If so, you can MIG weld. Folks act like
> welding is some mystical black art, and only the "anointed ones" that
> have the elusive "welding genes" are allowed to operate the sacred
> welding equipment.
>
> I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
And how good were those welds? Do you really want to trust your life to
them in a collision? There's a story about WWII submarines. The welders
would get into a hurry, trying to get the things out the door. The welds
LOOKED good, but they weren't. They failed and leaked. Not a good thing
in a submarine. Then they started taking the welding crews down on the
maiden voyages. The quality of the welds improved immensely. Can your
7th
graders reliably recognize a bad weld?
Mike can weld, too. But he feels it is well worth the price to pay a very
talented, experienced fellow to weld up our battery racks, because this
guy
really KNOWS what he's doing. No "bubble gum" welds here.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979 >>
I to know how to mig and tig weld since its part of my job.I repair
welders
for a living and half of the service calls I preform on welding equiptment
are
Operator error. Theres a select few
folks
that I allow to weld on the Current Eliminator.
Dennis Berube 4000+ SAFE qt.mile runs in an ev
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 21 May 2005 14:47:57 EDT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > I have taught 7th grade girls to MIG weld in less than an hour.
>
> And how good were those welds? Do you really want to trust your life to
> them in a collision? There's a story about WWII submarines. The welders
> would get into a hurry, trying to get the things out the door. The welds
> LOOKED good, but they weren't. They failed and leaked. Not a good thing
> in a submarine. Then they started taking the welding crews down on the
> maiden voyages. The quality of the welds improved immensely. Can your 7th
> graders reliably recognize a bad weld?
What the h*ll does that have to do with anything in this discussion?
We're not welding pressure vessels, nor are we welding high alloy
steel. We're squirting mild steel onto either mild or low carbon
steel.
Just for the record, I was formerly a certified welder and a certified
nuclear non-destructive testing inspector. >I< can teach someone to
make structurally sound MIG welds that will pass dye penetrant and
ultrasonic inspection in hours. I'm sure he can too. I taught my ex
in about an hour and by the end of the day her welds were even pretty.
John
---
John De Armond
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My old charger, now Glenn's, has the green case, 2 fans, and the breaker
that looks like a toggle switch. Which I thought made it a "Rev 1"
rather than a "beta". Whatever you want to call it, it is looks like this:
http://www.manzanitamicro.com/pfcdone.jpg
(and it has a nice new breaker installed, right Glenn? :-)
J.R. Young wrote:
Rich,
I think it may be a beta charger. It's Jim Coate's old PFC20. Does that
change your answer to number 2?
Glenn
--
Jim Coate
1970's Elec-Trak's
1998 Chevy S-10 NiMH BEV
1997 Chevy S-10 NGV Bi-Fuel
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
