I've read all of them, there is nothing about what it is supposed to solve...
Please state it here and now... do not refer to inexistant post. 2014-02-06 Edgar L. Owen <edgaro...@att.net>: > Quentin, > > Please refer to my extensive posts to Jesse for that... > > Edgar > > > On Thursday, February 6, 2014 1:21:13 PM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > >> So, what is it ? What is it supposed to solve in the first place ? >> >> >> 2014-02-06 Edgar L. Owen <edga...@att.net>: >> >> Quentin, >>> >>> But it's NOT the case... >>> >>> Edgar >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thursday, February 6, 2014 10:52:58 AM UTC-5, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> 2014-02-06 Jesse Mazer <laser...@gmail.com>: >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Feb 6, 2014 at 9:01 AM, Edgar L. Owen <edga...@att.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> But recall that p-time is not a directly measurable quantity so >>>>>> "arbitrary precision" does not apply. You still haven't grasped the >>>>>> concept >>>>>> correctly. P-time has no direct measure, because the present moment is >>>>>> that >>>>>> in which all measures, including those of clock time, are computed. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I don't recall you ever spelling that out in conversation with me, >>>>> thanks for clarifying. In the past people had asked you about how to >>>>> determine p-time and you had said things like "we should be able to >>>>> compute >>>>> p-time from Omega, the curvature of the universe" (in the post at >>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/everything-list@googlegroups. >>>>> com/msg47450.html ). So if you now say that determining which events >>>>> are simultaneous in p-time is fundamentally impossible for any being >>>>> within >>>>> the universe, that answers what I was wondering about in question #1. >>>>> >>>> >>>> If that's the case... what good is it to entertain such "p-time"... >>>> it's useless. Predict nothing, cannot be measured. What is p-time supposed >>>> to solve ? >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Jesse >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Nevertheless the fact of existence of all observers and thus of >>>>>> everything in the present moment is a direct empirical observation. Just >>>>>> like consciousness it is not subject to measure, but that doesn't mean it >>>>>> doesn't exist. >>>>>> >>>>>> Edgar >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thursday, February 6, 2014 12:47:05 AM UTC-5, jessem wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 7:38 PM, meekerdb <meek...@verizon.net>wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 2/5/2014 9:31 AM, Jesse Mazer wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> --question 1 dealt with the question of how YOU would define p-time >>>>>>>> simultaneity in a cosmological model where there's no way to slice the >>>>>>>> 4D >>>>>>>> spacetime into a series of 3D surfaces such that the density of matter >>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>> perfectly uniform on each slice (and that uniform can be characterized >>>>>>>> by >>>>>>>> the parameter Omega), unlike in the simple FLRW model where matter is >>>>>>>> assumed to be distributed in this perfectly uniform way. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't see that perfect uniformity is necessary. We have >>>>>>>> calculated our epoch relative to the CMB as 13.8By. I assume any other >>>>>>>> scientific species in the universe could do the same and so say whether >>>>>>>> they were 'at the same time' as measured by expansion of the cosmos. I >>>>>>>> don't see how the existence of galaxies and galaxy clusters precludes >>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>> kind of measurement. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Using the CMB may give an approximate answer, but would you argue it >>>>>>> could distinguish between different simultaneity definitions that agree >>>>>>> approximately when averaged over large scales, but disagree somewhat >>>>>>> about >>>>>>> the details of simultaneity in highly curved regions? For example, could >>>>>>> the CMB be used to define a unique definition of simultaneity in the >>>>>>> neighborhood of a black hole (where coordinate systems like >>>>>>> Schwarzschild >>>>>>> coordinates and Eddington-Finkelstein coordinates and Kruskal-Szekeres >>>>>>> coordinates give very different definitions of simultaneity)? Edgar >>>>>>> isn't >>>>>>> just claiming some approximate pragmatic truth about simultaneity, he's >>>>>>> claiming an absolute and exact truth about simultaneity in all >>>>>>> circumstances, I was asking if he thinks this truth can be empirically >>>>>>> determined to arbitrary precision even in principle, and if so what >>>>>>> empirical observations would be used. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jesse >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Brent >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy >>>> Batty/Rutger Hauer) >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy >> Batty/Rutger Hauer) >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy Batty/Rutger Hauer) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. 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