On 11 Jun 2014, at 16:24, John Clark wrote:
On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 3:34 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
wrote:
> Free will is the ability to make choice,
And the ability to make a choice is the capacity to have free will
and round and round we go. Finding a synonym and finding out more
about how the world works is not the same thing.
Glad you agree it is synonym. Of course that is only an approximation,
and we know both the nuance to add, given that we have the same theory
of free-will (up to possible other nuances that I can miss).
> and for that you *need* some amount of determinacy
I agree, the only person I can think of that might be completely
free from cause and effect is somebody undergoing a severe epileptic
seizure.
Which is when the neural brains go out of a (deterministic) chaotic
regime.
Actually Grim and another guy studied version of Gödel and Löb theorem
in fuzzy logic (meaning that they use the closed interval [0, 1] has
set of truth values. They illustrate that the truth values of most
fixed points in self-reference logic describe chaotic trajectories (in
the set of truth value).
This suggests we can fuzzify the eight hypostases, and that could be
of use to handle the non monotonic layer needed for Löbian machines in
deep contexts.
Again, the randomness (in the sense of normal statistical testing) of
that deterministic chaos has no other rôle in free-will than
augmenting the degree freedom space, in some case virtually or mentally.
> and its necessary self-indeterminacy.
We have self-indeterminacy?? I could not fail to disagree with you
less.
This astonished me, as in this case, it is the Turing one, or
variants, which exists thanks to theorems proved in computer science
(using usually the double diagonalization procedure).
> Randomness adds nothing, as you see well
I have no idea what you mean by that, randomness clearly adds a
whole lot of stuff, usually more than we'd like.
I meant "randomness adds nothing in the free will", except that it can
augment the freedom spectrum, and it might diminish the complexity of
the task or of comparing the possible tasks.
I just defend the (well known in philosophy) compatibilist theory of
free-will. It is (simply) the will of a subject in a free (virtual or
real) environment, or in a structured set of such free (virtual or
real) environments (emulated in arithmetic, for example).
Bruno
John K Clark
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