On 9/25/2014 9:47 AM, John Clark wrote:
On Thu, Sep 25, 2014 at 3:18 AM, Russell Standish <li...@hpcoders.com.au <mailto:li...@hpcoders.com.au>> wrote:

    > The trouble I have, is that there are obvious ways of achieving the same 
ends that
don't involves consciousness

I don't see how you could know that. Other than by observing behavior how do you know what does and doesn't involve consciousness? For that matter, other than by observing behavior how does Evolution know what does and doesn't involve consciousness? If Evolution can't see it then Evolution can't select for it, and yet Evolution made me and I am conscious; this fact severely limits the number of hypothetical processes that can possibly produce consciousness.

There are many processes that can produce motion and evolution has found a lot of them, but not all (e.g. not electrostatic propulsion).

Brent

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