Chris,
I was stumbling around for science articles, when I cam across this social science study from the EU, Germany specifically Chris, which is more nuanced then my view and less naive (my word) than yours. Its worth the read, and informs the subject we argue about. Not too long either. http://www.science20.com/news_articles/how_prevalent_is_islamic_fundamentalism_in_europe_its_alarming-152350 -----Original Message----- From: spudboy100 via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Fri, Jan 16, 2015 3:15 pm Subject: Re: Democracy Your mistake is comparing hand grenades to nerve gas. The Zetas want money and power, while Boko Haram wants money, power, the lust to kill, and paradise with babes forever. You do not see the Zetas or the Mafia wiping out a magazine headquarters, nor do we see meth heads becoming suicide bombers. You are performing the narrative of the Bamer administration because my pov (based on observation) is offensive to your weltanschauung. Its not your fault that the Islamists behave in such a way, and neither is it mine. ISIS is Islam, and says so in its rule books. Think of the comparison of how Christianity behaved say, from 325-1945, with wars, slaughters, racism, hatred, and all those other fun things. This is Islam today and the nice guys are in the minority. ISIS doesn't need to be the Reich to do heavy damage, because honestly the Germans weren't that illogical, irrational yes, illogical no. Breivik in Norway was a neonazi that saw his fellow Norwegians as traitors to the fatherland. Breivik wasn't seeking paradise, in the same sense that Pol Pot in Cambodia wasn't seeking paradise. Janah or Paradise, is what literally gets Muslims up in the morning, factually and allegorically. -----Original Message----- From: 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Fri, Jan 16, 2015 1:11 pm Subject: RE: Democracy From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 8:19 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Democracy I don't know if I'm a likable fellow, and I'd say probably not, but thanks. The war and clash of civilizations thing comes up in the absence of some better alternative. Being overly polite with the Islamists leads to Boko Haram and Paris, I truly believe, because they view gentleness as weakness. Who is “they”? Muslim culture in general, or specific criminal gangs of thugs using Islam as a justification and cover for their crimes? The killings are worldwide, in places, on a far smaller scale as in Thailand and the Philippines and India. Gang killings occur in every country. Organized criminal thugs are operating in many places around the world, not just in Muslim countries. Why do you constrain yourself to fight only organized criminal organizations that operate under cover of Islam, using it as a fig leaf to cover their murderous actions? Do you think the Zetas and other Mexican drug cartels (or any of the other drug cartels for that matter are not as murderous? I used to live and drive all over the region of Mexico and South Texas where the Zetas; that whole region has been terrified by these murderous criminal thugs who have beheaded people before ISIS got into that game (ex. 2013 beheaded four woman allegedly tied to a rival gang). They have done many mass killings; more than 60,000 people have died in Mexican drug wars. The reason, in large part, is the Islamists want to achieve immediate entrance to Janah, or Paradise, where they get endless access to women, and good times forever, for sacrificing now. Blablabla… yeah so they tell you. Criminal thugs are not motivated by such stupid fairy tales, these are hardcore criminal psychopaths who are using Islam as window dressing. ISIS is not the Third Reich; to make that comparison is fucking laughable. ISIS is an organized murderous criminal gang. It should be dealt with in that manner and portrayed in this light. ISIS is not Islam, in the same way as that asshole who mass murdered all those teenagers in a summer youth camp in Norway is not Christian. -Chris This is one reason. In a way, this is akin to letting the 3rd Reich or Japanese imperialists gain power and momentum in a war, which most nations didn't want-then war becomes the only solution, because things then become existential. This seems to be happening once more with the Islamists-which appear to be gaining momentum today. Points to be remembered on this forum. No I don't have the proper answer, nor do I have influence to effect events, for good or ill. It's just my attempt at problem solving, and sometimes being bloody-minded is something that needs to be thought through, before choosing a better option. That is if we have options? -----Original Message----- From: 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Fri, Jan 16, 2015 2:06 am Subject: RE: Democracy From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2015 12:48 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Democracy Brent says true, in that terrorism is a method, not an end in itself. I wonder if people would agree to the terms, as a war against Islamist extremists, or radical Jihadis or? I think naming the enemies of freedom and peace in the middle east in nigeria with boko haram, and today in belgium (Hi Bruno) would be more acceptable, in that its limited targets, for a limited duration. Also, the mean of 'war' need not be violent, because you can't beat an idea with war alone. You’re a far more likable fellow, when you don’t do the gung ho go to war talk. P.S. What Boko Harem did in the towns of Baga and Doron Baga – during the same days as what went on in France FYI – is a first order war crime. They massacred 2,500 people (Muslim African people) and destroyed almost 4,000 buildings, literally razing those towns to the ground. They surely should be hunted down and arrested for their horrible war crimes, including the enslavement of all those school girls, but it should be a police action, not a war, and certainly not a crusade! Bastards like that don’t deserve the honor of being treated as enemies, they are criminal murderous thugs, and in a just world would be brought to face justice. -Chris -----Original Message----- From: meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Thu, Jan 15, 2015 1:04 pm Subject: Re: Democracy On 1/14/2015 11:52 PM, 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List wrote: In case no one has noticed, our dear president Obama has changed the rhetoric used as cover for our Orwellian systems state of permanent war…. The term “War on Terror” is bad enough, it implies an endless war requiring an Orwellian intrusive state. But at least it seemed circumscribed to opponents it could describe as being involved in terror. Obama is now calling it the “War on extremism”. That term sends Orwellian shivers down my spine; it is so broad and arbitrary in nature and can be used to describe any and all opponents. Sigh, everybody's so paranoid about government. Obama started using "extremism" because the chattering classes kept pointing out that terrorism is just a tactic and you can't make war on a tactic. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. 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