On Tue, Jul 3, 2018 at 8:12 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote:

​>>​
>> ​Nobody has ever seen a demonstration of a non-physical calculation in a
>> book and nobody ever will.
>
>
> ​>* ​*
> *That contradicts all publication in the field.*
>

Maybe that's true if your field is flying saucer men in Roswell New Mexico
or other varieties of junk science, but show me one citation from the
journal Nature or Science or Physical Review Letters or The Journal of
Applied Physics demonstrating a non-physical calculation. Just one will do.
​

> > *You seem to never have open any book nor paper in that subject*


That's because opening a book requires energy as does performing
calculations, and pure numbers are unable to give me any energy so I am
unable to open a book much less perform a calculation.

​> ​
the whole point will be that there is nothing unique concerning any
computations.
​ ​
All are implemented in infinitely many ways in Arithmetic.

​
Yes and out of those infinitely many ways of doing arithmetic all but one
of them is incorrect, that is to say only one of those ways is compatible
with physical reality and that is the one the sheep herder who invented
arithmetic many thousands of years ago decided to use because it was the
only one that helped him with his job.

Your fundamental blunder is you've forgotten what a function is, you've
forgotten what your high school algebra teacher said on the very first day
of class, he said a function is a machine, you put something into it and if
you perform the calculations it says to perform something different will
come out. A function is instructions written in a very compact form but by
itself it can't do anything. A cake recipe is not a cake nor can it make a
cake without the help of a baker, a baker that is made of matter that obeys
the laws of physics.

​>​
>> but physics can.
>
>
> *Really?*
>

​Yes really.​


> *​> ​How?*
>

​With NAND and NOR circuits made from mechanical rods ratchets and gears or
vacuum tubes or transistors or microchips or some other arrangement of
matter that obeys the laws of physics, such as the neurons in the bone box
on your shoulders.


> ​*>​*
> *If mechanism is true, I don’t see how that primary matter can influence
> consciousness or create it*
>

It does not make the slightest difference if you understand the connection
between matter and consciousness or not because it remains a experimental
FACT that when your brain changes your consciousness changes and when your
consciousness changes you brain changes. Matter doesn't care that you have
not figgured out how matter produces consciousness , matter does it does it
anyway.


> *​>​without invoking some non Turing computable,​ ​and non FPI
> recoverable, notions.*
>

Nobody has ever provided even the tiniest speck of evidence that there is a
connection between Turing non-computability and consciousness other than
consciousness is sorta weird and non-computability is sorta weird.

​>​
> *A book cannot make a computation, trivially, but a number, relatively to
> other numbers, do it, thanks to the laws of addition and multiplication.*
>

​Why those rules when there are a infinite number of ways two numbers can
be associated with a third number? Because even though the sheep herder who
invented arithmetic lived thousands of years before Newton he knew
intuitively that only one of those ways was compatible with the laws of
physics.

John K Clark

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