On May 12, 2008, at 9:47 AM, new.morning wrote:
Along the lines of Danielou, its my understanding that the Brits' having a class system at the time that was rigid and oppressive transformed the Indian caste system. In contrast, the latter was based on tolerance and respect for castes, and strong self-and family esteem for the excellence of the family's crafts, learning, talents, etc. The Brits used caste as a divisive and culturally crude tool of conquest and control using divide and conquor, stimulating caste tensions and rivalries, and playing/pitting one caste against another.
Yes, this is precisely what I heard as well. In some cases, as with masters of Indian martial arts who could kill with a mere blow, they were sought out and had their hands cut off.
They created caste in their own image of class hatred, loathing and bitterness -- as an exploitive tool. The way to get ahead in this neo-psuedo caste system was to play by British rules. Maharajas were bought off and towed the new party doctrine. And the maharajas supported the priests and "clergy" who also learned how to play the game. Over 300 years of explotiation, imperialism and racism, the Brits successfully transformed a working system of caste guilds, reasonably benefical to all castes in anagrarian society, into the putrid stew that Curtis critiques. If you are going to damn anyone, I would think the ruling Brit class is far more on target than shanks.
One of the things we were taught in Intro. to Soc. was that Britain was a classic example of a stratified social system. Most Brit's can here a few words and know where someones "place" is in society. Guitar god and singer-songwriter Richard Thomspon speaks of this nasty aspect of British society in his song "Crawl Back Under My Stone":
Crawl Back (Under My Stone) Written by Richard Thompson Appears on Mock Tudor (1999) Semi-Detached Mock Tudor (2002) Live in Providence DVD & EP (2004) live from austin tx DVD & CD (2005) This time you hurt me You really did it this time you did Did you count your fingers after shaking my hand God forbid Riff raff crawling from the slums Right there in front of all your chums I swear by the pricking of my thumbs I'll make your day and melt away I'll crawl back under my stone I'll crawl back under my stone I'll crawl back under my stone But you won't have to stand next to me You won't have to introduce me You won't have to think about, talk about, care about, me I'll crawl back I've got a nerve just showing my face don't you think Scruffy little likes ought to know their place don't you think Old boy, sorry to intrude Damn shame pretty bloody rude I should be horsewhipped and sued Then I'll go quietly my tail between my knees I'll crawl back under my stone I'll crawl back under my stone I'll crawl back under my stone But you won't have to stand next to me You won't have to introduce me You won't have to think about, talk about, care about, me I'll crawl back I want to be middle class Floors and ceilings made of glass I just want to be, I just want to be free You had me in a second you had it all reckoned, you did You guessed my game and my name, rank and number, you did Somehow I gave myself away Some code, some word I didn't say I missed one line in the play And the trap shut tight and you did me all right I'll crawl back under my stone I'll crawl back under my stone I'll crawl back under my stone But you won't have to stand next to me You won't have to introduce me You won't have to think about, talk about, care about You won't have to ask about, fuss about, discuss about You won't have to mind about, swear about, forget about, me Crawl back I'll crawl back I'll crawl back Crawl back I'll crawl back Crawl back Crawl back I'll crawl back
I was asking Curtis if he knew SBS full or deeper view on caste. While Dandielou is one voice, he echoes a view that presumably stems from SBS via his student K.
Precisely why I chose that example.
That view does not appear exploitive, oppressive, elitist or hate-based. While it may or may not be useful in a post-industrial age, being originally designed for agrarian societies, I think it is fool hardy to adamantly reject all aspects of it based on a horrid use and mutilation of it by the Brits.
Yep.
I suggest that genetics as a basis for indentifying and culturing traits that excel in various professions and careers, and having a strong, tolerant and vibrant flows of cultural and genetic heritage may be a good thing. Albeit there are many exploitive scenarios, as in anything, that could also unfold. However, to equate and damn the British rape and bastard child caste system as that which a deeply spiritual culture and generations progressively cultivated -- is quite short-sighted.
Danielou adds interestingly that the varna system today is seen in career and educational systems based on IQ (which is largely inherited).
