--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard M" <compost...@...> Me: > "I think it alters my neuro transmitters which makes it very enjoyable > and addictive for me. So without feeling that it was doing more for me > outside meditation, I couldn't justify the time spent" >
Richard: > Try substituting "listening to great music" for the word "meditation" in > the above, and I hope you will see what I mean. I suspect that your > attitude is driven by a preconception of what is "inside" and what is > "outside", and that the former is not "real" in some way. > > The quietness, the silence that I sense through TM is something that I > think is profound. It has a "pregnancy" about it that seems to point to > even more (if I could just get there!). I like that and it pulls me > in. It's no different (for me) than the sense of the poetic/profound > you might get from, I don't know, a beautiful sunset, a walk by the > ocean, or anything else that floats your boat. But more so. I can relate to this last part. I agree. I think that my experiences in nature are more similar than different. > > Materialists and scientistic types will just shrug all that off as > "just" feelings, and just some fog in your brain. Their loss I would > say. They need to get over their religion. Again I agree. I wasn't bringing in the neuro transmitter theory to diminish it. Where I differ with yoga theory is their assumption that this silence has ontological implications. That is the jump I don't make. For me I am experiencing a pleasurable silence, not the home of all the laws of nature or my higher self. But your appreciation for the experience for its own sake is something I can relate to. Meditation is a very charming experience. > wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > <curtisdeltablues@> wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard M" <compost1uk@> wrote: > > > You felt that then? That meditation was kind of "numbing" you or > > > something? > > > > > > I think I re-started TM again about the time you began your > > > "experiment". To be honest my experience is the opposite, if anything. > > > I have to say I am pleased with how it's going. Is your experiment > > > still ongoing? > > > > I'm definitely offering my experience of meditation as some kind of > > last word on what meditation does. I think its effects can be > > different for different people in different circumstances. > > > > That said, for me meditation very quickly becomes addictive. I needed > > to meditate twice a day to feel right. I would feel a need for "rest" > > in the afternoon, which is not typical when I don't meditate. It > > enhances a sense of dissociation that I don't need. I could perceive > > no cognitive benifits from it other than that the experience itself is > > very enjoyable. I think it alters my neuro transmitters which makes > > it very enjoyable and addictive for me. So without feeling that it > > was doing more for me outside meditation, I couldn't justify the time > > spent. But it is always there for me as a nice break when I need one. > > Since I don't believe it is cultivating something as a cumulative > > effect regular meditation doesn't make sense for me. > > > > I'm glad to have it in my mental toolbox as an option. When I stopped > > meditating in '89 after my intense 15 years with 4 years of rounding, > > it took me a long time to reconnect with my feelings with the intimacy > > I feel now. As soon as I felt the practice separating me from that > > intimacy I stopped meditating. I was only regular for 6 months last > > year. > > > > So it wasn't a numbing of emotions, it creates a detachment from them > > that I don't prefer as a style of functioning. It is the opposite > > state of feeling I need as an artist. I know people claim it enhances > > feeling, but that is not my experience. It shifts me into a different > > relationship with my feelings. If I had a lot of negitive feelings > > that might be an asset, but I don't so for me it isn't. > > > > Tell me about your experiences. Are you experiencing benifits in your > > activity? > > Well, yes - at least I think so! > > I relate very well to a lot of what you say. The actual practice is > great. But when you open your eyes, is anything different, has anything > changed? > > I certainly do not feel any negative change (I have not noticed the > detachment from emotions that you describe). > > The practice feels as if it should be good for my health (and it seems > to be qualitatively different to the kind of health benefit you would > undoubtedly achieve in any case by just relaxing for 20 minutes). > > Beyond that - the danger is to assign anything good that happens to > "benefit of meditation". And yet I dunno, I do "sense" something! I feel > good; I think I sleep better; Apparently I am less grumpy; And I have > this odd feeling that events are unfolding more "for" me than against > me. I'm sorry, but there it is. There's no need to shout, I hear your > groans. > > Where I don't see eye-to-eye with you is exemplified in this sentence of > yours: > > "I think it alters my neuro transmitters which makes it very enjoyable > and addictive for me. So without feeling that it was doing more for me > outside meditation, I couldn't justify the time spent" > > Try substituting "listening to great music" for the word "meditation" in > the above, and I hope you will see what I mean. I suspect that your > attitude is driven by a preconception of what is "inside" and what is > "outside", and that the former is not "real" in some way. > > The quietness, the silence that I sense through TM is something that I > think is profound. It has a "pregnancy" about it that seems to point to > even more (if I could just get there!). I like that and it pulls me > in. It's no different (for me) than the sense of the poetic/profound > you might get from, I don't know, a beautiful sunset, a walk by the > ocean, or anything else that floats your boat. But more so. > > Materialists and scientistic types will just shrug all that off as > "just" feelings, and just some fog in your brain. Their loss I would > say. They need to get over their religion. >
