Edg, I like your humor and wisdom. My comments to your piece are as follows:
1. Krishna never died! He willingly disappeared according to Shrimad Bhagavatam. I don't know how Vyasa (the presumed writer of SB) knew that, since as he writes, even the demigods were puzzled by the disappearance. This story presents a different interpretation of Krishna's involvement with human beings, as compared to Christ's death on the cross. My surface interpretation of the story is that Krishna wants people to fight for their salvation (dharma in the vedic context) even if one has to kill his or her own relatives. If humans need some more help in the future, he will incarnate again to make things right. I'm not sure if he will disappear as he did before. A few years ago, I remember reading an article between Prabhupada and a Christian monk about Krishna. Prabhupada said that Krishna and Christ are one and the same. So, there you go. Any great spiritual teacher in the future could possibly be Krishna's incarnation. 2. The story of Job is a complicated one. I agree with you in that the devil appears to have cornered the Almighty in agreeing to test Job for his loyalty to the Jewish concept of God. There's a rational theological explanation for this story. But I'm sure you already know it. It appears to me that this story is another variation of the Devil's temptation of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. In the first temptation, my take on the story is that Adam and Eve were tricked to believe that they can become divine through knowledge derived from the senses. That is, they were duped to believing that the relative existence is the basis of divine life. The points you covered above could be a great topic for a theological discussion. So, I will quit here and listen for others to make their comments. Regards, John R. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hmmmm, I'm no expert; I have concluded from my readings of Hindu > scriptures that Krishna's death marked the beginning of Kali Yuga. > Dwapara Yuga folks are supposed to live 2,000 years or something like > that, so I'm as confused as a non-expert can be, but it doesn't > matter. (And by the way, I'm not saying Sat Yuga was a better Yuga. > Doing perfection, being sacred, resonating with purity, they're all > lovely ways to dance, but Kali's wicked boogies can get one's foot > a-tapping, right?) > > And for the sake of discussion, could we leave out NOW for the nonce? > That concept NOW just takes the wind out of any discussion's sails. > > Let's pretend time exists. > > The Srimad Bhagavatam lists a series of evil kings that are to come > into power in Kali Yuga, and, well, it sure sounds like some of those > folks are already here! Can't get much worse than getting oral sex in > a closet or drilling for oil in the last of our pristine wildernesses > while Darfur further callouses the hearts of our world's > civilizations. Oh, to be sure, we'll have kings that eat babies for > breakfast, and then Bill or George will seem like sweet flowers, but > Darfur in Kali or Darfur in Dwapara will suffice to crush anyone's > pride in humanity's core values. > > But, it doesn't matter all that much -- if we DO agree in the concept > that holds that the trend of time is towards manifesting darker and > darker material. Like God, today's masses sure love their gory > movies, right? So, it's God dream, and, like us, He too can conjure > up a dark tale -- you know, for entertainment's sake. Like when God > and Satan diddled bigtime with Job. When God and Satan took decades > to see how miserable they could get Job to be, see if he had a > breaking point, well, classic drama, right? Funzies! (By the way, > "God" is a word I use more for the Absolute than for a manifest > personage.) > > The concept "God loves a good horror story" is perhaps the hardest > concept to "sell" to anyone "locked into" the dogma that posits God > being pure goodness in the relative. This "take" makes it very hard > to understand God's wisdom when we see the carnage of the world. Oh, > "returning bad karma," we chant in our litanies -- as if payback was a > bad thing, could ever be a bad thing, as if! But we slip into denial > fast when it comes to our doorsteps -- what parent chants those words > when seeing a sick -- seemingly innocent -- child? Where's our deep > resonance with God's dalliance into the poignancy of "hard times" > then, eh? Doesn't matter much then if we're imprisoned in a Kali or > Dwapara jailcell. > > This is a very sticky wicket when it comes to owning one's life, > because if one has been trained to identify the ego as a "do gooder," > then anytime God wants a bit of black paint added to the area of the > canvas where one is standing, it becomes excruciating to see one > "doing creepy shit." > > Not creepy like smelling bicycle seats, nothing as easily classified > and rejected like that; no, I'm talking about how creepy it is to be > angry with a loved one instead of, you know, sane. There's where evil > enters the world -- in the nuance of the details -- keeps us on the > slippery slope, set us up for a long slide down. Try getting rid of > that psychic addiction. > > If God said, "Quick, I'll fix your personality in one of two ways, > your choice. I can either guarantee that you will never -- for > funzies -- smell a bicycle seat in your entire life, and as a bonus, > I'll toss in that you will never ever kill anyone either. > > Or, you can have door number two, and if chosen, I'll change your > personality such that you never get miffed again with a loved one, > but, yeah, if I need a person in my grand dream to smell a bike seat > and get off on it, well, you might be in the right place at the right > time for me to use you like that. > > Probably, as crudely stated, as un-thought-out as the above choice > scenario might be, there's a big fraction of the world's folks who'd > choose the "never smell-kill" fix -- even though their egoic processes > are fairly certain that they never do either action given the > personalities they seem to be in their limited parochial views of > themselves. > > Yet it is not the other the better choice? "Better" means "would have > less stress in one's daily life." > > Not that you have the choice! Just a moot question. > > God is the one Who has the choice, right? > > If you had the choice, you'd be God, right? > > But, your next thought, you're waiting for God to give that to you, right? > > Don't have to be a Hindu to see the end of time coming. Just be a > true-believer-physicist. At the end of the universe's life, at heat > death, as you sit in your ringside seat, waiting for the last photon > to decay into virtuosity, maybe then you'll know what your next > thought will be, because that would be the last possible thought that > God could have, right? But otherwise, we're all as dutiful as > ventriloquists' dummies, right? We pretend to speak, while all along > it is Big Nose, the Divine Cyrano de Bergerac, Who must poke His > Sacred Proboscis into our business as He sings through our wooden > heads, right? > > Now here's the rub, the shudder I feel: knowing that God is infinite > and willful to boot, and that no darkness will be left unexplored, not > the least speck of evil will be unexamined, and that He will see it > through our eyes, and feel it through our hearts. > > Scared yet? > > But from ringside, if you can get the good tickets, it'll be glorious. > > Even being miffed at a love one -- could be so entertaining as, noir > at least, right? > > Ask Job how beautiful the darkness is. > > Edg > > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams" > <willytex@> wrote: > > > > Duveyoung wrote: > > > And before that, I made believe that this > > > isn't really Kali Yuga > > > > > Most Hindus are mistaken about this. According to > > Swami Sri Yukteswar, the beginning of the present > > Yuga, Dwapara, began in 3100 B.C. > > > > Swami Sri Yukeseswar was a great authority on > > Vedic astrology. > > > > Source: > > > > 'God Talks With Arjuna' > > by Paramahansa Yogananda > > Page xxi > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > I'm not a big one for conspiracy theories, period, > > because of Occam's Razor. It's always more likely > > that the event(s) transpired because of Everyday > > Human Stupidity than because of some elaborate plot > > that would then need covering up. > > > > But the reason I'm replying, Edg, is to talk about > > self-fulfilling prophecies. That seems to me to be > > what's going on in your comments about Kaliyuga > > below. It's like you *assume* that Kaliyuga is a > > reality, not a myth. Therefore, since it IS a reality, > > the world's fucked no matter what we do because... > > duh...it's Kaliyuga, and in Kaliyuga *everything* > > is fucked. Being fucked is "God's plan" during > > Kaliyuga. > > > > Self-fulfilling prophecy. What if every "yuga" in > > human history were just puny little humans trying > > to get their puny little minds around the illusion > > of time vs. the reality of Now? They make up all > > sorts of stories about how Now *seems* fucked > > because it's not part of the *cool* yuga. We're > > fucked because we're living in the *uncool* yuga, > > Kaliyuga. And if you buy into this crap, you buy > > into Never Really Trying Very Hard To Change Things. > > > > How could we change this great, cosmic cycle of > > yugas, after all? IT (the myth) is...uh...cosmic, > > after all, and we're just actors in some kind of > > low-rent soap opera called Kaliyuga, reading our > > lines and acting them out without any say in > > the script and the story it tells. > > > > Not my kinda myth, sorry. > > > > If I were to believe in a myth, it would be that > > individuals CAN change the world they find themselves > > in, right here, right now, and that imaginary cycles > > of time have nothing whatever to do with it. > > > > "God's plan?" Man, I don't believe in a God, period, > > much less that he/she/it has a *plan*. The universe > > is Just What Happens, and we all MAKE it happen. > > We achieve what we believe we can achieve, and myths > > that seem to have been *designed* to make us believe > > that we can't achieve very much because it's "Kaliyuga" > > just don't float my boat. > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > It's hard enough getting my head wrapped around the facts dealing with > > > the 911 Towers coming down and that it might be an evil -- supremely > > > evil -- inside job -- my jury's still out on it, but if ever such a > > > deal could be pulled off, BUSHCO wouldn't have a problem with green > > > lighting it, and THAT global entity blackheartedness is the real place > > > where the media sun don't shine. > > > > > > But the fake-trip-to-the-moon paranoia just cannot grab me anymore. > > > There's tons of solid debunking of that theory, so I don't need to > > > cover that territory -- just google it. But to save you the time, > > > here's my best retort. The concept I know of that really cuts to the > > > bottom line, the one that most works for me to prove we actually did > > > go to the moon, is the fact that during those days, the USSR was in > > > our face for everything, and so there's a whole country of scientists > > > that would have loved to prove that NASA was faking it and shame us > > > before the world (you know, like politicians have done to us) -- and > > > the Soviets had all the artifacts, photos, etc. that conspiracy > > > advocates use even today, but nothing like a BIG EXPOSE happened -- > > > the USSR never cried foul. And if they couldn't prove it, no youtube > > > video is going to prove it. > > > > > > But hey, from late 1998 to late summer 1999, I thought Y2K > > > computer-date errors were going to be the end of civilization, so if > > > you believe NASA never went to the moon, who am I to toss the first > > > stone at ya? > > > > > > And before that, I made believe that this isn't really Kali Yuga, and > > > that I was a doer with potency, and that if we all just got enough > > > silence, we'd turn into good people. But then I found out that a > > > "good" person in Kali Yuga is the one that manifests God's plan: > > > which is to manifest KALI YUGA! God wants to see every kind of > > > darkness now -- and He's got us creating it all. And if we help out, > > > we're the good guys, doncha see? If we resist, well, that's just so > > > Kali Yuga can snuff the resisters -- no matter how many yagyas they > > do. > > > > > > It's going downhill, folks. But hey, it's a free ride! > > > > > > Edg > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > cardemaister <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-Qhqzg99t4 > > > > > > At 4:30 and 7:30 the stones on the foreground > > > > > > seem exactly the same!? :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The voice-over at 4:30 mentions the crater. It's just bad > editing > > > > and > > > > > direction. At the 7:30 mark, the voice mentions this four > kilometer > > > > > drive to get to the crater, so it creates the illusion that > they're > > > > > going somewhere new that the video piece hadn't shown yet, but in > > > > > actuality, they'd edited in a clip of that crater > > segment.....call it > > > > > a teaser.. > > > > > > > > > > Edg > > > > > > > > > > > > > What do think of this? > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch? v=uU5YyolUHAw&mode=related&search= > > > > > > > > > >
