I'm so
sorry about the gray tabby.
For those times when you can't be there with him, if you put a stuffed
animal in his nest he will have something to cuddle up to.
----- Original Message -----
From: catatonya
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Date: Monday, July 17, 2006 1:06 am
Subject: RE: anyone got advice for me tonight? urgent!
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> The gray tabby has died. The solid gray seems to be in good
> shape. The kitten that died did poop several times which I took
> as a good sign.........
>
> The living gray kitten seems to be doing ok. He will nurse, and
> he has urinated, but that's all so far.
>
> I read on a website to massage the area before and after feeding.
>
> I'm going to take the little gray kitten to bed with me tonight
> and see how it goes. I don't want to leave him by himself since
> he lost his littermate.
>
> Thank you everyone. I hate just about everyone except people
> like you who are on this list. :(
>
> t
>
> Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:
> I have absolutely no experience with kittens that
> young but isn?t there also something about sort of ?massaging?
> their rear so that they eliminate?its something mom cat does?
>
> Anything I?ve ever read about real young kittens suggests
> replicating what mother would do?she?d be nuzzled up against them,
> moving them around when she felt like moving, feeding on demand
> and using her body to keep them warm. They stay close to mom to
> hear that heartbeat and get the comfort. So, making a pouch and
> holding next to you can?t possibly hurt, it seems to me.
>
> Chris
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:Felvtalk-
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nina
> Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 1:16 AM
> To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
> Subject: Re: anyone got advice for me tonight? urgent!
>
> I would feed them more often than that esp since you fear that
> they were abandoned for a while. Don't stress out if they refuse
> to eat each time, but do offer it to them. I'm so glad the one is
> seeming to feel better. I can understand why they suggest not
> "over handling" them, but they are writing this for, pardon me,
> but the majority of idiots out there that would be handling them
> differently than you. I don't expect that you'd be manipulating
> them and keeping them awake. They will sleep just fine next to
> your body, probably better. I understand you concern about
> disease, you do, after all, have an felv kitty in the house, but
> unless you are allowing them to crawl around with everyone else,
> they should be fine under your t-shirt. I don't know, they've
> already been through so much, if you can give them some warmth and
> a feeling of security, I think it's worth the risk. I guess
> there's the possibility that they are carrying something that
> might endanger your guys,
> but I really think if they had something horrible, like Panluek,
> they'd be gone already.
> Nina
>
> catatonya wrote:
>
>
> I had been carrying them around and keeping them warm inside
> my shirt, but one of the websites I read said that I should keep
> them away from all other cats because they may not have immunity
> from their mother.
>
>
>
> I just don't know. The other cats were in the vacated house.
> One of these kittens was on one side of the trash cans and the
> other was on the other side. They were not together. So
> basically we have no idea if they were being moved in the house,
> out of the house, or abandoned.
>
>
>
> Since they are only 2-3 days old and were covered in maggots I
> would say they had been there a while. I didn't see the place
> itself to see if it was a place the cat might have felt
> comfortable having the kittens in, but I doubt it. The house has
> 3 boxers. (2 were thrown off an overpass July 3rd, and the reason
> I was at their house was because I was passing out reward fliers
> for them.) There are lots of other stray dogs and cats in that
> area, and those people didn't keep their boxers confined. So I
> can't imagine the cat had the kittens there and was just trying to
> move them in. There's been a lot of comotion in the area since
> the incident with the dogs. The people were out putting a fence up
> today (what a concept!). They said they kept hearing crying and
> found the 2 I took. The tips of their ears are a little bloody
> suggesting flies biting them and hence the maggots.
>
>
>
> I just don't know. NO ONE is going to take in that mother cat
> and the rest of those babies. And there's no way I can either.
> DD (my positive) is stressing out just knowing these kittens are
> here. She's overgrooming way more than normal and I just dosed
> her a pred.
>
>
>
> I think I'm going to go put some honey on the sick ones gums.
> He does seem to be a little better. I'm keeping my fingers
> crossed. I also read that I shouldn't bother them (pick them up,
> etc.....) too much between feedings for the first week because
> they are so weak at this age they need to sleep.
>
>
>
> I started feeding them every 2 hours, but read on several
> sites NOT to feed that frequently...........I've gone to 3 now.
>
>
>
> always something................
>
>
>
> thanks for the advice. I'm going to go check on them now.
>
>
>
> t
>
> Nina <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:
>
> Hi Tonya,
> Not a good sign that these two kittens were separated from the
> mother and other babies. You know what that could mean, they may
> be weak and she decided to let them go to try and save her energy
> and milk for the others. It may also have meant she was in the
> process of moving them and hadn't gotten back to these two yet. I
> have a really good home made kitten formula made from goat's milk
> that I will send to you off list. It's better than any powder
> form because it's fresh. When I give a kitten light karo to try
> and stimulate their energy, I put the tiniest amount on my finger,
> or Qtip and then wipe it on their gums, that way there is no
> chance of aspirating them. As far as keeping them warm, esp the
> one that's getting colder, the best thing to do, if you can, is to
> keep them under your shirt next to your skin. They will feel
> comforted by your warmth and heartbeat, and you will also know
> immediately if they are in any sort of distress. While your up
> and walking around,
> you can fold a large t-shirt under and secure the "pouch" with
> safety pins and just carry them around like a momma kangaroo. Be
> very careful that the temp of what you have rigged for them is
> constant and not to hot or cold. The best thing to do is have a
> container that's just large enough to afford a space that isn't on
> the heating pad, or hot water bottle, but is still cushioned.
> With kittens this young, I don't know if they'd even be able to
> move off of it when too hot though. Bless it girl, I feel for
> you. I would guess that the temp should be slightly less than
> normal body temp, but I'm not sure about this. They are so young
> and fragile! I understand why you would say you probably should
> have had them pts, and also understand why you couldn't! You
> should probably be offering them food every 1/2 hour or so at
> first, I wouldn't go much more than an hour apart until they are
> eating consistently. With two week old kittens, I think it's
> recommended to feed every
> two hours. I could have sworn I had a better website than this
> one, but there may be some info for you here:
> http://www.caring4kittens.com/index.html
> Blessings and prayers for the babies, you and the ones still out
> there. Hopefully momma isn't feral, you catch her ass, and she's
> healthy enough to care for her kittens. If she did abandon these
> two, she might change her mind about caring for them when she's
> safe, warm and fed. If you do end up adding them back into her
> litter, make sure you rub them on the other kittens first to pick
> up the scent of the rest of them.
>
> Have you gotten in touch with MC? I know that she's had lots of
> experience with kittens. Hideyo recently took in days old kittens
> w/o a mom and did really well with them too. I don't have MC's
> number, but I do have Hideyo's, I'm sure she wouldn't mind a late
> night phone call in an emergency.
> Prayers for the babies,
> Nina
>
> catatonya wrote:
> thank you. I just gave him some sugar water. I hope that
> might help.
>
>
>
> I was very careful, but I don't know if the 'drooling' means I
> aspirated........... or he's got a uri or what. :( i'm going to
> take his temperature. I have them in a bathroom with the vent
> closed and covered. I have a heating pad on the floor and then a
> towel and then a litter pan and then another towel and then the
> kittens and then a towel over them. I'm going to try to check the
> temp of that too.
>
>
>
> both of these kittens way around 3 oz. Sites I've been
> looking at say they should be born weighing more than that!
>
>
>
> They had maggot eggs (not crawling yet) on them......... so
> they must have been there for a while. We found the mother and
> other kittens in an abandoned house but we can't do anything about
> any of it until tomorrow. ugh. The lady that found them is going
> to break into the house and put the kittens that remain in a
> basket with a towel and give the mother food and water till we can
> decide what to do tomorrow.
>
>
>
> t
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> I wouldn't have them euthanized just because they are little.
> I take
> in small kittens all the time.
>
> I don't use KMR. I use Fox Valley. They sell all kinds of milk for
> all kinds of animals. Better IMHO than KMR and cheaper.
>
> You have to mail order it though...I keep about a pound of the
> powder
> on hand at all times, but I take in a lot of litters.
>
> http://foxvalleynutrition.com/main/home.asp
>
> Sometimes little kittens just die and there is nothing you can
> do:(
> As I am sure you know mortality among kittens is really high:(. Is
> the
> little one eating? If he won't suck you can feed from a syringe.
>
> Drooling doesn't appear to be a great sign:
>
> http://maxshouse.com/kitten_care.htm
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: catatonya
> Date: Sunday, July 16, 2006 7:52 pm
> Subject: anyone got advice for me tonight? urgent!
> To: "felvtalk@felineleukemia.org"
>
> > Hey guys,
> >
> > long story short.......... I am home with 2 (vet said 2-4.......
> > I say 2 tops) 2 day old kittens.
> >
> > Of course it was sunday and i had to go to emergency vet. he
> > said they seemed ok for the circumstances and told me to bottle
> > feed and keep them warm.
> >
> > that cost $100
> >
> > I knew I should just have them euthanized. I know there are no
> > homes. I know there are more than the shelter can handle
> > etc.......... but I brought them home.
> >
> > The smaller one will suckle and take the kmr (walmart brand
> > recommended by vet. is that really all right??)
> >
> > The other seems to be drooling from his mouth. Everytime I
> > check him he seems colder and colder. I have them on a hot water
> > bottles on a towel and have even put it inside a heater. I've
> put
> > them in bed with me.
> >
> > I don't think he's going to make it.
> >
> > Any ideas as to why he might be drooling and what I might could do?
> >
> > tonya
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
