What remains a fact is:
I can probably issue my two whois commands and get the pertinent info
required here faster then you can point and click up neotrace, which might
not even get the info, being that pings and traceroutes might well be
blocked or dropped before ever reaching the requested site. Course, since
IS depts are so often 'overstaffed' and workloads so light, and an assault
on your network<s> so non-critical, taking the time to then decide upon
and open another cute little tool is not a concern, yes? Remember, yer
in the hotseat there, time and efficiency matter. Unless of course, if
you have all the time you wish to putz about. There are times that
the choice of tools does matter.
This was not ment as, nor is a religious rant, cept on getting some folks
to drop into a commandline, and preaching the quick and concise way to
accomplish the chore at hand. And, perhaps I'm overly sensitive here.
Definately preoccupied with other matters at present, and so responding
quite quickly... I've actually worked in IS depts whence not a single
person on the rest of the staff knew how to play at a dos prompt, let
alone one in unix. I remember folks staring in awe back when opening
sysedit was a majikal tour. And there are folks I've worked 'with' that
could not, and still most likely can't, understand why regedit exists.
Even though there may be two, five, ten ways to get a chore done, most
often, one way is the quick precise way while most others are exercises
for 'extra credit'.
Please, send further flames in private, no reason to muss up everyone's
mailbox. And Bryan's got better things to do with his time then
moderating those that are reading me as a OS religious fanatic.
Thanks,
Ron DuFresne
<neither chatholic nor protestant>
On Fri, 18 Feb 2000, Karl Wahala wrote:
> So Ron - How do you REALLY feel about Windows?
>
> Pretty impressive rant I must say, and very amusing, but a rant
> nevertheless. I mean, we all get like this sometimes, right?
>
> I wanted to shoot you an answer right after wading through it, but waited a
> few hours and read it again. Glad I did...
>
> A bit long for flame bait, but still I waited for the inevitable flame war
> to escalate. I'm feeling only a trifle guilty for being disappointed at the
> complete ennui surrounding this inflammatory post; I had hoped for lengthy
> amusement lurking behind the sure to come religious war. It is to the credit
> of the list at large that no one rose to the bait :-) I was going to flame
> you off-line, but thought the better of it, and decided just to post to the
> list, maybe we'll get an anger management thread started...
>
> Now, dig it - I try to be a practical man. I have a couple SPARCS (even one
> running FW-1)with different generations of SOLARIS. I have HP-UX on HP 9000
> hardware. I have Nortel (Bay) routers and switches. Even a few REALLY big
> ones. Over 300 Ethernet / Fast Ethernet nets. ATM Backbone. ATM Local loop
> into the telco. ISDN. DSL, PVC'ed back to my switches over telco. Frame
> relay. 3 com boxes. Ascend boxes. Many NT servers; File, print, SQL,
> Exchange, web, blah, blah, blah. CDPD AND private radio to data terminals in
> 800 cars. S/390.
>
> Oh, yea -- also VERY tiny staff.
>
> I LIKE UNIX. I LIKE NT. I have to know the command line for a shitload of
> devices and variants. I enjoy using the command line. (impresses the hell
> out of the unwashed, right?)
>
> ALL the devices and system flavors in my environment came about as a result
> of BUSINESS decisions. Not whether or not someone really liked the GUI or
> not. And let's face it -- if you are not intimately familiar with the guts
> of FW1 or Exchange, the GUI is not much help, is it now? Also, the Bay stuff
> among others, have GUI tools for management which go beyond the command
> line. And, a question: Would OpenView be useful without a GUI? Even as
> graphical as OV is, it takes a LOT of snake charming at the command line and
> script level to make it work. Anything that makes my gig easier and helps me
> achieve my ends is a good thing, as long as I know what the score is --
> whether it's a quick "kill -HUP" on my DNS box or a logically organized
> tabbed dialog in Exchange Server.
>
> Lastly -- Most of my ~5000 users, those poor fools who have to create
> documents, print spreadsheets, and such, could GIVE A SHIT! As long as I
> keep it all running! Many of them are barely capable of logging on, but must
> be served. They do other stuff -- other than a basic knowledge of their app
> and keyboard / screen, why should they HAVE (and the key word here is have)
> to know anything about command lines or RFC 1483, or TCP / IP?
>
> Lighten, up chief! Maybe later, I'll show you how to right cick... :-)
>
>
>
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