Stan: 1. "energy is primary being less abstract" -- How is energy detected or measured? Something observes a distinction. From a series of distinctions, the Observer constructs an understanding. It emerges from bit. In this way, Information is more abstract.
2. "from some as yet incompletely defined substrate" "information implies more than one entity (sender-receiver, object-interpreter)" --- I think this is the key issue. The received view is that the fundamental level is pure randomness, which explains why some want to get rid of causality completely. Since Parmenides, at least, it has been clear that entities require some ground in which to exist and act---a "ground of being," or in Media Studies, a medium. Energy requires a medium, and so cannot be primary. 3. "if they are not identical, energy and information always accompany one another"---I think one must distinguish between the view of mathematics and physics, and the actual world. "Energy" and "Information" are alternative mathematical formalisms and views of physicists. Whether the actual world agrees depends on the details of one's own understandings and one's own cosmology. Ideally, the correspondence would be perfect, but obviously this is not the case for anyone. Malcolm Dean Member, Higher Cognitive Affinity Group, BRI Research Affiliate, Human Complex Systems, UCLA Today's Topics: > > 1. information.energy (Stanley N Salthe) > > Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2014 09:34:03 -0400 > From: Stanley N Salthe <ssal...@binghamton.edu> > To: fis <fis@listas.unizar.es> > Subject: [Fis] information.energy > to Joseph > Joseph -- Commenting on: > > We may agree that, if they are not identical, energy and > information always accompany one another and may have emerged together from > some as yet incompletely defined substrate. However, they may not be, do > not have to be and for me are not at the same ontological level, and energy > is primary being less abstract. > > Is there not also a sense that information implies more than one > entity (sender-receiver, object-interpreter)? That too would tend to align > with the idea of energy being primary. > > STAN >
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