Cari Steven Ericsson-Zenith, Pedro e Tutti, proprio da qualche mese ho iniziato a scrivere un libro in cui, fra l'altro, affronto ancora una volta il tema dell'informazione dell'armonia o dell'armonia dell'informazione. Specialmente in questi giorni, dopo avere passato in rassegna le diverse teorie del valore delle scuole o correnti economiche che si sono succedute, sto rivisitando la mia teoria del valore basata sui surplus generati dai quattro tipi di informazione: termodinamica o naturale (neg-entropia), genetica (DNA-RNA-proteine), matematica (bit di entropia) e semantica (significato ottenibile con un s-codice che si sovrappone ad una fonte di informazione equiprobabile). In fondo, non bisogna fare altre che una ri-unificazione del sapere come sostiene anche Jerry Chandler. Ho sempre sostenuto che la natura e la società hanno un'armonia meravigliosa, non inficiata dai disaccordi, dai contrasti e dalle diversità pur esistenti. L'ultimo messaggio che ho inviato il 3 agosto a conclusione della discussione precedente ribadisce quindi l'esigenza inderogabile di com-prendere il possibile tutto o il tutto possibile con la fusione (non con la confusione) degli orizzonti. Un grazie a Ericsson-Zenith per l'abile introduzione che ci ha offerto e a Pedro, regista inimitabile di queste magnifiche iniziative. Francesco Rizzo
2015-09-11 18:58 GMT+02:00 Robert E. Ulanowicz <u...@umces.edu>: > I'll have to weigh in with Stan on this one. Stan earlier had defined > information more generally as "constraint". It is convenient to employ the > IT calculus to separate constraint from indeterminacy. This is possible in > complete abstraction from anything to do with communication. > > The ability to make this separation has wide-ranging consequences. For > example, it provides a pathway by which process philosophy can be brought > to bear on quantitative physical systems! It is no longer necessary to > rely solely on positivist "objects moving according to law". That's no > small advance! > > < > https://www.ctr4process.org/whitehead2015/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/PhilPrax.pdf > > > > The best, > Bob > > > Pedro wrote" > > > >>Most attempts to enlarge informational thought and to extend it to life, > > economies, societies, etc. continue to be but a reformulation of the > > former > > ideas with little added value. > > > > S: Well, I have generalized the Shannon concept of information carrying > > capacity under 'variety'... {variety {information carrying capacity}}. > > This allows the concept to operate quite generally in evolutionary and > > ecological discourses. Information, then, if you like, is what is left > > after a reduction in variety, or after some system choice. Consider > > dance: > > we have all the possible conformations of the human body, out of which a > > few are selected to provide information about the meaning of a dance. > > > > STAN > > > > STAN > > > > On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 8:22 AM, Pedro C. Marijuan < > > pcmarijuan.i...@aragon.es> wrote: > > > >> Dear Steven and FIS colleagues, > >> > >> Many thanks for this opening text. What you are proposing about a pretty > >> structured discussion looks a good idea, although it will have to > >> confront the usually anarchic discussion style of FIS list! Two aspects > >> of your initial text have caught my attention (apart from those videos > >> you recommend that I will watch along the weekend). > >> > >> First about the concerns of a generation earlier (Shannon, Turing...) > >> situating information in the intersection between physical science and > >> engineering. The towering influence of this line of thought, both with > >> positive and negative overtones, cannot be overestimated. Most attempts > >> to enlarge informational thought and to extend it to life, economies, > >> societies, etc. continue to be but a reformulation of the former ideas > >> with little added value. See one of the last creatures: "Why Information > >> Grows: The Evolution of Order, from Atoms to Economies" (2015), by Cesar > >> Hidalgo (prof. at MIT). > >> > >> In my opinion, the extension of those classic ideas to life are very > >> fertile from the technological point of view, from the "theory of > >> molecular machines" for DNA-RNA-protein matching to genomic-proteomic > >> and other omics' "big data". But all that technobrilliance does not > >> open per se new avenues in order to produce innovative thought about the > >> information stuff of human societies. Alternatively we may think that > >> the accelerated digitalization of our world and the cyborg-symbiosis of > >> human information and computer information do not demand much brain > >> teasing, as it is a matter that social evolution is superseding by > >> itself. > >> > >> The point I have ocasionally raised in this list is whether all the new > >> molecular knowledge about life might teach us about a fundamental > >> difference in the "way of being in the world" between life and inert > >> matter (& mechanism & computation)---or not. In the recent compilation > >> by Plamen and colleagues from the former INBIOSA initiative, I have > >> argued about that fundamental difference in the intertwining of > >> communication/self-production, how signaling is strictly caught in the > >> advancement of a life cycle (see paper "How the living is in the > >> world"). Life is based on an inusitate informational formula unknown in > >> inert matter. And the very organization of life provides an original > >> starting point to think anew about information --of course, not the only > >> one. > >> > >> So, to conclude this "tangent", I find quite exciting the discussion we > >> are starting now, say from the classical info positions onwards, in > >> particularly to be compared in some future with another session (in > >> preparation) with similar ambition but starting from say the > >> phenomenology of the living. Struggling for a > >> convergence/complementarity of outcomes would be a cavalier effort. > >> > >> All the best--Pedro > >> > >> > >> > >> Steven Ericsson-Zenith wrote: > >> > >>> ...The subject is one that has concerned me ever since I completed my > >>> PhD > >>> in 1992. I came away from defending my thesis, essentially on large > >>> scale > >>> parallel computation, with the strong intuition that I had disclosed > >>> much > >>> more concerning the little that we know, than I had offered either a > >>> theoretical or engineering solution. > >>> For the curious, a digital copy of this thesis can be found among the > >>> reports of CRI, MINES ParisTech, formerly ENSMP, > >>> http://www.cri.ensmp.fr/classement/doc/A-232.pdf, it is also available > >>> as a paper copy on Amazon. > >>> > >>> Like many that have been involved in microprocessor and instruction > >>> set/language design, using mathematical methods, we share the physical > >>> concerns of a generation earlier, people like John Von Neumann, Alan > >>> Turing, and Claude Shannon. In other words, a close intersection > >>> between > >>> physical science and machine engineering. > >>> > >>> ...I will then discuss some historical issues in particular referencing > >>> Benjamin Peirce, Albert Einstein and Alan Turing. And finally discuss > >>> the > >>> contemporary issues, as I see them, in biophysics, biology, and > >>> associated > >>> disciplines, reaching into human and other social constructions, > >>> perhaps > >>> touching on cosmology and the extended role of information theory in > >>> mathematical physics... > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Fis mailing list > >>> Fis@listas.unizar.es > >>> http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> ------------------------------------------------- > >> Pedro C. Marijuán > >> Grupo de Bioinformación / Bioinformation Group > >> Instituto Aragonés de Ciencias de la Salud > >> Centro de Investigación Biomédica de Aragón (CIBA) > >> Avda. San Juan Bosco, 13, planta X > >> 50009 Zaragoza, Spain > >> Tfno. +34 976 71 3526 (& 6818) > >> pcmarijuan.i...@aragon.es > >> http://sites.google.com/site/pedrocmarijuan/ > >> ------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Fis mailing list > >> Fis@listas.unizar.es > >> http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > Fis mailing list > > Fis@listas.unizar.es > > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Fis mailing list > Fis@listas.unizar.es > http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis >
_______________________________________________ Fis mailing list Fis@listas.unizar.es http://listas.unizar.es/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fis
