>
> i can't believe i'm getting into a fluxpissing match (and over something
> that could only possibly be of interest to subscribers in toronto...)
ddyment, it's very difficult to have a constructive argument on email
without sounding like an ass, it happens to me all the time! let's give
each other the benefit of the doubt on that. what is it about this medium
that people can't have a debate without seeming angry? i for one find this
conversation stimulating, and my only motivation is to exchange ideas and
learn.
and i think the discussion is sufficiently general to be of interest to
subscribers in places other than toronto. in any case, i won't continue
discussing the specifics of the panel.
>
> the connection to fluxus and pop music is hardly weak - the two most
> influential bands in pop music had fluxus members in them! John Cale of
the
> Velvets contributed a film of Police Car Lights to a Fluxfest and John
> Lennon contributed several works and attended festivals. Also their
> connections, respectively, to La Monte Young and Yoko Ono made for an
even
> stronger connection/influence.
i understand that the personal connections are there, but i question
whether there are strong connections in the actual work. i don't deny the
presence of experimentalism in rock and other popular musics, but i
generally feel that the presence of non-experimental elements, such as a
strong beat, a verse/chorus structure etc., are what allow the work to be
attended to (or unattended to) easily - it is still relatively coherent.
another disctinction may be that rock experimentalism tends to be (but is
not always) challenging on a social and political level, whereas the avant
garde is often challenging on conceptual and perceptual levels. if this is
the case, then paik's 'one for violin solo' (i think that's the correct
title) and pete townsend's smashing the electric guitar are rather
different pieces.
what do you think? i would love to hear views....
> sampling and cut-n-paste rock is the aural equivalent to visual collage
i understand the analogy, but i question whether pop sampling (which i
love) as analogous as other work. james tenney's "collage #1 (blue
suede)" from the 1960s, is the first plunderphonics piece i know of, and of
course john
oswald, chris cutler and so on have done great things in this area too.
> yoko's mending pieces
have you seen that piece by...maybe eva hesse? it's called exploded cube
or something. it is a perfect cube that had been built, exploded, and then
rebuilt. who can help me remember this one?
> of concretism and said she was still enjoying the piece an hour later
> because she could see the parts of the shattered violin.
yes, and i agree that the piece was still going on in a sense, but i don't
get what that idea has to do with maciunas' concretism. help me out.
pleasure talking with you lot.
HSOJ
