O don't remember meeting them but thst doesn't mean I didn't. I will explore those links. Thanks, Steve.
--- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Mon, Mar 24, 2025, 1:48 PM steve smith <[email protected]> wrote: > Frank - > > my sister and her husband (gringo from Wisconsin) moved to Seville Spain > in the late 70s because it was one of the few places he could work as a > (freshly minted) Copper Exploration Geologist in the global mineral mining > context of the time. They both became fluent in Castilian while there, > then moved to Santiago Chile (same reasons, different era/hemisphere) where > the Spanish spoken was closer perhaps to the Castilian roots than what I > knew from the backwoods of W. NM and then the AZ/Sonora border. > > When I moved to Northern NM, there was a whole other spin offered via the > Norteno dialect with ancient roots, some isolation and integration with > Puebloan vocabulary and idioms. When my sister and husband would visit > or bring visitors from Spain or Chile it was interesting for them (the > visitors) to haughtily correct various vocabulary, idiomatic or > pronunciation "errors" which were simply regional dialectical differences, > some rooted in 500 years of history. > > I don't know how broadly distributed the languages of colonial European > powers are today... English and Spanish being the dominant in the new world > with French a distant third along with Portuguese and Dutch just a > smidge? I think Pieter indicated that Dutch and English are > equally/similarly represented in modern Afrikaans language/culture? > Portuguese has an interesting play in indonesia and Belgian pops up here > and there as well? There must be an uncountable (idiomatically not > mathematically) number of dialects and pidgens and creoles? > > When Matt and Janire (CultVR/4piProductions) first visited here around > 2009, Janire (Najera from Najera, la Rioja, Espana, Basque Region) was > almost completely unaware of the Spanish Colonization of this area. New > Spain was barely in her history. The Spanish Embassy in the US funded her > to do a book project documenting the old Spanish Trail, yielding a book, > virtual tour, and a traveling exhibit. She interviewed a lot of Spanish > descendents along the trail from here to southern California. > > > https://www.spainculture.us/city/washington-dc/moving-forward-looking-back-journeys-across-the-old-spanish-trail/ > > https://www.artbook.com/9788416282197.html > > https://janirenajera.com/moving-forward-looking-back/ > > I think you met them in the context of sfX during the heydey? > > > On 3/24/25 12:56 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote: > > My maternal grandparents were both native New Mexicans who lived their > whole lives here. My grandfather was genetically German but he spoke > Spanish better than he spoke English. Once he came to visit me when I > lived in married student housing at Carnegie Mellon. There were a couple > of Mexican guys who were in some summer classes who had become friends of > mine. I introduced them to my grandfather. One said to the other in the > typical Mexican sing-song way of speaking "Ven. Quiero que conozcas a un > Gringo que habla mejor que nosotros" (Come, I want you to meet a Gringo > who speaks (Spanish) better than we do) My grandfather said, "Habla como > un hombre! No Cantes." (Talk like a man. Don't sing.) > > --- > Frank C. Wimberly > 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, > <https://www.google.com/maps/search/140+Calle+Ojo+Feliz,++%0D%0A++++++++++Santa+Fe,+NM+87505?entry=gmail&source=g> > Santa Fe, NM 87505 > <https://www.google.com/maps/search/140+Calle+Ojo+Feliz,++%0D%0A++++++++++Santa+Fe,+NM+87505?entry=gmail&source=g> > > 505 670-9918 > Santa Fe, NM > > On Mon, Mar 24, 2025, 12:26 PM steve smith <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> Steve: >> Do all your friends and neighbors have the Red Cards no matter their >> status? In fact, probably all of us should be carrying them. >> T. >> >> For the most part, we operate on a don't ask, don't tell basis. The >> only folks with known status to me are those who have achieved a full >> green-card status after years of temporary work stints, etc. The rest are >> likely under various radars. Often there is an adult child, likely born >> in the USA who is peripherally involved. My Spanglish is good enough to >> negotiate lots of work and social situations but nothing as sensitive as >> legal immigration status and I stay far away from those discussions as a >> matter of respect. I try to telegraph that I am an ally but don't belabor >> it. >> >> https://www.ilrc.org/red-cards-tarjetas-rojas#item-4477 >> <https://www.ilrc.org/red-cards-tarjetas-rojas#item-4477> >> >> I grew up with kids whose parents (more often grandparents) did not speak >> English. Not because they had immigrated from MX but because their >> ancestors lived in the territory which became the US while they lived >> there. In the mountains Western NM, some of the parents (born in the >> early 1900s) were raised in Spanish-only households among Spanish-only >> social/family networks. The kids grandparents likely were children when >> their families immigrated to the area from the Rio Grande valley after the >> Civil War (when the newly formed/available US Cavalry rounded up or killed >> the native Apache living in the area). >> >> In Southern (Douglas) AZ, many of these families had equal >> representation on both sides of the border that was drawn with the Gadsden >> Purchase. Some living on the MX side may have been deported there during >> the 1st world war or depression when there were attempts to displace >> "mexicans" from the US without due process. May have been part of the >> "alien enemies" act activities of the time. >> >> I think the Gadsden purchase included the Mesilla Valley in NM (nod to >> REC) but in my case it was the region south of Tucson in AZ. >> >> .- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / >> ... --- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-.. >> FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv >> Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom >> https://bit.ly/virtualfriam >> to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com >> FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ >> archives: 5/2017 thru present >> https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ >> 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >> > > .- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / ... > --- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-.. > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: 5/2017 thru present > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > .- .-.. .-.. / ..-. --- --- - . .-. ... / .- .-. . / .-- .-. --- -. --. / > ... --- -- . / .- .-. . / ..- ... . ..-. ..- .-.. > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Fridays 9a-12p Friday St. Johns Cafe / Thursdays 9a-12p Zoom > https://bit.ly/virtualfriam > to (un)subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: 5/2017 thru present > https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >
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