Kahn Academy it is! Thank you. Pieter, I have had a lifetime of experiences with experts who agree that the answer to my question is so obvious that I should not be asking it, but who, when brought together, cannot agree on an answer. That's what I mean by the emperor's new clothes paradigm. Is "entropy" such a situation? Or does "entropy" a code for disparate conceptions? If so, is that OK? Or is it a disequilibrium, a tension that must in time be relaxed?
I hoped I had conveyed in my posts my profound skepticism about George. Perhaps not. For instance, he repeatedly will assert that compression increases entropy, which consensus contradicts. That is such a terrible blunder that I asked him to report himself to his bosses, which he promised to do. But, being the person he is, he may or may not have done so. Nick ________________________________ From: Friam <[email protected]> on behalf of Pieter Steenekamp <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2025 1:23 AM To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Entropy RE-redux Nick, Tread carefully when using George as a tutor—especially if you're aiming to go deep rather than just skim the surface. If you want to feel entropy in your bones, I wouldn’t rely too much on standard AI models (like our friend George here). He has a tendency to hallucinate—not in a poetic, Einstein-on-a-bike kind of way, but more in the “sending-you-down-the-wrong-rabbit-hole” sense. The nuances of entropy are subtle, and it’s easy to be misled if your guide has a shaky grip on the terrain. So, what do I suggest? Abandon George altogether in your quest for entropy? Not quite. Start with Khan Academy (https://www.khanacademy.org/) — their basic thermodynamics content gives you a solid foundation, and yes, entropy is part of the curriculum. It's clear, structured, and free. If you hit a wall, consider their premium AI tutor, Khanmigo (https://www.khanmigo.ai/) . This is also a George—but one designed specifically to teach, not just chat. He's less likely to wander off-topic and more likely to actually help you make sense of the second law of thermodynamics. It's not free though. Hope that helps! On Tue, 17 Jun 2025 at 05:32, Santafe <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Zen moment Nick: On Jun 17, 2025, at 12:00, Nicholas Thompson <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: I’ve gone back to feeling that I don’t even know enough to ask a question. Just there for an instant, the teacup dipped below full. btw.: this sentence is a wonderful encapsulation of the difference between the metaphysician and the scientist. Welcome back. Frank’s language below is good. It’s work to understand it, of course, but the crucial starting point is that it admits an understanding because there is a consistent thing being asserted. Eric You've probably done this. Nick. Yes, entropy (S) is a state variable in thermodynamics. Here's what that means: * Definition of a State Variable: A state variable (or state function) is a property of a thermodynamic system that depends only on the current state of the system, not on the path or process taken to reach that state. If a system is in a particular equilibrium state, its state variables will have specific, unique values. * Why Entropy is a State Variable: * Path Independence: The change in entropy between two states is the same regardless of the reversible or irreversible path taken to go from the initial state to the final state. * Unique Value for a Given State: For any given equilibrium state of a system (defined by other state variables like temperature, pressure, and volume), there is a unique value of entropy. * Mathematical Property: Mathematically, a quantity is a state variable if its differential is an exact differential, meaning that its integral over a closed path is zero. This is true for entropy. * Contrast with Path Variables: In contrast, quantities like heat (Q) and work (W) are not state variables. The amount of heat transferred or work done depends entirely on the specific path followed during a process. In summary, entropy is a fundamental property that characterizes the state of a thermodynamic system and is independent of its history. --- Frank C. Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Santa Fe, NM On Sun, Jun 15, 2025, 9:27 AM Nicholas Thompson <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Same setup as before. Cylinder with two plungers and a peggable slider at dead center. Lets fill our compartments with bbs of the same volume. Unpeg the divider. Now lets tap on the two opposite plungers with a series of blows of the same average magnitude but different but different positive skew in the distribution of magnitudes. Will the divider move? -- Nicholas S. 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