Re: [Futurework] More myopia and all that ~ looking thru the tele scope vs looking in the mirror?

Mon, 29 Sep 2003 19:57:48 -0700

Ray,
 
I just watched a documentary called "A Place Called Chiapas". It gives a flavor of what you talk about.
 
 
When "the Arnold" said that he, as an immigrant, understood the plight of Mexicans, what he failed to realize was that the majority of the people he was referring to were not immigrants. The Europeans were the immigrants. That is the group to which 'the Arnold' belongs.
 
Bill
 
 
On Mon, 29 Sep 2003 18:56:00 -0400 "Ray Evans Harrell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
The descendants of the Jamestown colony now number 10 million people in contemporary America.   The descendants of the 30 million (conservative estimate) that were pre-columbian inhabitants now number officially less than 2 million and unofficially about 8 million.    How do you make amends for such things?    The descendants of the Africans have made a big comeback and Indians from Mexico that are called Hispanic are now the largest minority in the US.    But our own Native peoples are still harassed and "authenticated" and used as the perfect victim while ignoring the real accomplishments and empowerments that would actually help our children.     Blood quantum rather than culture and family means that our people have inforced intermarriage in order to maintain what little we still have from the rotten deals in the first place.
 
 
Ray Evans Harrell
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Ed Weick
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Futurework] More myopia and all that ~ looking thru the tele scope vs looking in the mirror?

You mean the same way we are making half hearted attempts at dealing with genocidal behaviour toward the aboriginals.  This happened all over the world.  As though the aboriginals were a weed or a pest--to be removed or displaced.

Yes, I know.  But during recent decades some countries, e.g. Canada and, to some extent, the US, have recognized the appalling things that happened.  Canada has gone a long way toward making amends through settling land claims, making provision for self-government, ensuring that treaty obligations were honoured, etc.  See my survey of all this at http://members.eisa.com/~ec086636/native_claims.htm
 
Ed
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 10:52 AM
Subject: RE: [Futurework] More myopia and all that ~ looking thru the tele scope vs looking in the mirror?

You mean the same way we are making half hearted attempts at dealing with genocidal behaviour toward the aboriginals.  This happened all over the world.  As though the aboriginals were a weed or a pest--to be removed or displaced.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ed Weick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2003 7:34 AM
To: Cordell, Arthur: ECOM; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [Futurework] More myopia and all that ~ looking thru the tele scope vs looking in the mirror?

Arthur, I like to believe (fantasize?) that there is some kind of tendency toward a moral normalcy at work in society.  People do something for one set of historical reasons, like kill six million Jews or 20 to 60 million Soviet citizens, but then history changes and the reasons for having done those things fade into the background.  Regret, even remorse, set in.  To the extent possible, restitutions are made, monuments built, etc.  Though I wouldn't put too much money on it, I'd be willing to bet that if Germany had won WWII, the world, especially Germany, would by now have been into several years of wondering why it did what it did and what could be done to make amends.
 
Ed

 
> I agree that the needs of the individual often have to give way to the
> greater good of the larger community.  But...but.  History usually finally
> decides whether the individual actor was a hero or a fool, or worse.
>
> So the person who says "hell no I won't go..."  can either turn out to be
> traitor or a hero, depending on winners and losers. 
>
> Just think with a German win in WW2, Eichmann stamps would probably have
> been issued by a victorious Germany along with statues of the man and
> holidays marking the emergence of  Judenfrei zones in country after country.
>
> Life is indeed a "crapshoot."
>
> To thine ownself be true.
>
> arthur
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harry Pollard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2003 12:47 AM
> To: Cordell, Arthur: ECOM; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: [Futurework] More myopia and all that ~ looking thru the
> tele scope vs looking in the mirror?
>
>
> Arthur,
>
> Or maybe " serving the individual conscience had to be subservient, and if
> necessary bent, to the higher purposes of the community."
>
> Harry
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
>
> Arthur wrote:
>
> >Ed said,
> >
> >However, what I think what he was saying was that serving the individual
> >conscience had to be subservient, and if necessary bent, to the higher
> >purposes of the state.
> >
> >
> >arthur
> >
> >Consider the number of corporate and government managers who have had to
> >stifle their individual conscience in order to serve the higher purposes
> >of the corporation/government as they do things they know to be
> >"wrong."  As they are involved in mass firings of people just to add to
> >"stock values."  ie., the bottom line.  Eichmann can be seen in
> >organizations everywhere when the goals of the abstract organizaiton take
> >precedence over the pain of the individual.
> >
> >I wouldn't be too hard on the Germans.  A bit too convenient.
>
>
>
> ****************************************************
> Harry Pollard
> Henry George School of Social Science of Los Angeles
> Box 655   Tujunga   CA   91042
> Tel: (818) 352-4141  --  Fax: (818) 353-2242
> http://home.comcast.net/~haledward
> ****************************************************
>
 

Reply via email to