Dear Jan, I would like to know the following details. I am working on pyrolysis for biochar production. I wanted to do catalytic/steam reforming of the volatiles and gases released during the process. Kindly give me an idea of catalyst and other details of reformation of these mixture into syngas.
Thanks & reagrds Dr.M.Vasanthi On 6/4/11, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote: > Send Gasification mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [email protected] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [email protected] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Engine operation on producer gas (Jim Leach) > 2. Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Tom Miles) > 3. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Thomas Reed) > 4. APL Gasification and Biochar workshop in 2 weeks, June 17-19 > (jim mason) > 5. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Paul S. Anderson) > 6. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Mikael Sj?blom) > 7. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Tom Miles) > 8. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Tom Miles) > 9. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Mikael Sj?blom) > 10. Re: Sawdust in Fan TLUD (Pete & Sheri) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2011 15:03:58 -0700 > From: "Jim Leach" <[email protected]> > To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" > <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Engine operation on producer gas > Message-ID: <74A2F76443EC4B99BD7A46B8921F8660@danatech01> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Tom, > It is way more complicated than that and gases can have the same heating > value and still have widely different combustion characteristics, > particularly when burned in a gas engine. An example is landfill gas vs. > producer gas that have the same heating value. I have spend two years on > this subject and I am done discussing it here. > > Best Regards, > > JAMES T. LEACH, P.E. > President > > DANA TECHNOLOGIES, INC. > 32242 Paseo Adelanto, Suite D > San Juan Capistrano, CA 92675 > Ph 949-496-6516 > Fx 949-496-8133 > Mobile 949-933-6518 > > > _____ > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 11:52 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Engine operation on producer gas > > > Work by various groups has shown that high compression engines do not suffer > the predetonation of methane based spark ignited engines when operated on > produced gas, which in turn allows for higher BMEP. The Caterpillar fuels > handbook states that low BTU gases can be run on their engines because the > air:fuel ratio is much lower and the stiochiometric mix of around 80BTU/SCF > going into the cylinder is around the same as a methane fired engine. > Hydrogen will cause 60% derating of a SI engine, and producer gas 20-30%. CO > does have an impact on the overall flame speed of the mix and compression > tolerance. > > Sincerely, > Leland T. "Tom" Taylor > President > Thermogenics Inc. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Leach <[email protected]> > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > <[email protected]> > Sent: Thu, Jun 2, 2011 11:53 am > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > > Tom, > CO does moderate flame speed as you say, but it does not correct the > hydriogen problem for an Otto cycle engine. The single best indicator for > fuel suitability for a gas engine is the methane number, and a producer gas > has a very low methane number. The relatively high CO content does not > help. For even very modest BMEP operation, a methane number of at least 60 > is required. A producer gas from biomass will make just about that and so > that will eliminate all high BMEP engines from consideration or > alternatively, they can be substantially derated. > > Best Regards, > > JAMES T. LEACH, P.E. > President > > DANA TECHNOLOGIES, INC. > 32242 Paseo Adelanto, Suite D > San Juan Capistrano, CA 92675 > Ph 949-496-6516 > Fx 949-496-8133 > Mobile 949-933-6518 > > > _____ > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]?> ] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2011 4:31 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > > With the exception that CO found in producer gas moderates the H2 combustion > rate and moves the potential compression ratio way up above CH4 tolerable > compression levels. There is also the question of whether taking the > producer gas to methane has the economic benefit of doing so when you are > then competing with natural gas which in the US is selling for $4/mmBTU. > > Sincerely, > Leland T. "Tom" Taylor > President > Thermogenics Inc. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Leach <[email protected]> > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > <[email protected]> > Sent: Wed, Jun 1, 2011 5:35 pm > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > > Thanks again Florian, > > I do have a couple of comments. You still have to cool the product gas down > for the gas turbine, not because of the turbine, but because of the gas > control valves. They have temperature limits that cannot be exceeded, > typically about 60C. Also, there is an energy benefit to methanation for > application to engines. The benefit is that converting the H2 to CH4 will > allow engines with higher BMEPs to be applied, and that means higher > efficiency, and greater output for the same engine frame size. > > Best Regards, > > JAMES T. LEACH, P.E. > President > > DANA TECHNOLOGIES, INC. > 32242 Paseo Adelanto, Suite D > San Juan Capistrano, CA 92675 > Ph 949-496-6516 > Fx 949-496-8133 > Mobile 949-933-6518 > > > _____ > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]?> ] On Behalf Of > Florian Nagel > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 4:07 PM > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > > Hi James > > Regarding gas engines, you are right that cooling is a must from a > thermodynamical perspective. Regarding gas turbines, a hot gas cleaning > process would be very nice to have (excuse me mentioning gas turbines in the > last sentence of the last comment?clearly doesn?t belong there?) because the > turbines have the potential to stand high combustion temperatures. The > according exhaust gas would be in turn very hot, which makes the use of this > heat possible in a bottoming cycle. So, looking at a gasturbine combined > cycle, high fuel gas temperature does make sense if you adjust the > combustion temperature in a way that the gas turbine stands it and if you > use the exhaust heat. However, this requires a hot gas cleaning process. At > PSI, we operated high-temperature fuel cell with producer gas that was > cleaned in a hot gas cleaning system where the gas temperature never dropped > below 500C. Thus, there are ways to remove tars, etc. at high temperature > (Catalytic partial oxidation or high-temperature reforming steps). Anyways, > I wouldn?t go so far and say that this technology is readily available ;o) > > In any case, methanation is a great way to convert woody biomass into a more > usable and storable form but I don?t quite see it in combination with gas > engines. Just to expensive and without real efficiency benefit if you aim at > electricity as end product. > > Cheers > Florian > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]?> ] On Behalf Of Jim > Leach > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 17:18 > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > Thanks Florian, > > If one wants to burn the product gas in an engine or a gas turbine you have > to cool and clean the gas anyway. So dropping the temperature would be a > part of the tar removal process and would occur anyway. Adding water is not > good because the product gas must be well below the dew point for the > combustion device. So it you put it in for methanation, you will have to > take it out later. But what I was interested in was simply converting the H2 > to CH4, because engines (including GT's) don't really like H2 (it burns too > fast). Reciprocating engines in particular, would much prefer a steady diet > of CH4. But I think I understand from your answer is that it is not worth > it. Unfortunately, an answer I was expecting. > > JAMES T. LEACH, P.E. > President > > DANA TECHNOLOGIES, INC. > 32242 Paseo Adelanto, Suite D > San Juan Capistrano, CA 92675 > Ph 949-496-6516 > Fx 949-496-8133 > Mobile 949-933-6518 > > > _____ > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]?> ] On Behalf Of > Florian Nagel > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 2:52 PM > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > Hi James > > I cant comment on the cost of the methanation step but I can comment on your > idea regarding a methanation step as fuel upgrade in a gasification- and gas > engine-based power plant. I did my thesis together with Jan at PSI working > on the combination of high-temperature fuel cells with woody biomass > gasifiers: http://e-collection.library.ethz.ch/view/eth:41553 . Hi Jan, I m > still on that list as you see :D > > Methanation is an exothermic process that yields the highest methane > concentration in the product gas when kept around 400C process temperature. > Hence, you ll first have to cool your syngas down to 400C. Depending on your > gasifier type and syngas composition, you might get into carbon deposition > problems (Boudouard reaction for example where 2 CO molecules decompose into > carbon and carbon dioxide). You can overcome these problems by injecting > steam into your syngas (which will cool it down at the same time..) which > you will also need to increase your hydrogen atom content in a way that > allows methanation. Then you can take it from there and produce methane. > > Problem I see is that by introducing water into your fuel gas, you already > lower its heating value. This results in a lower combustion temperature in > your gas engine. Gas engines are limited by the Carnot efficiency rule that > clearly states that the efficiency of a combustion engine increases with the > difference between the temperature of the hot compressed combusted gas and > the temperature of the expanded exhaust gas. Hence, the efficiency of a > combustion engine running on humidized syngas should definitely be lower > than running on unhumidified syngas. Next problem is, during the methanation > you have to cool the reactor. Thus you are again reducing the energy content > of your syngas or by that time synthetic methane (relative to the energy > content of the initial feedstock). The energy you extract from the > methanation process is in form of low-temperature heat (400C) which you can > hardly use economically to produce electricity with a steam cycle. Once you > have your synthetic methane gas mixture, you ll have to reduce the high > water content of it to not run into above mentioned efficiency issues of the > combustion engine. This can only be done by cooling the gas close to ambient > temperature were the water simply condenses. Another point in the process > were you extract energy at very very low temperature level. I would consider > this energy as a complete loss. From there you can use the dried, cold > synthetic methane in your engine and produce electricity. > > To put it in numbers: Good gasification-gas engine plants reach efficiencies > around 25 to 30% without bottoming-cycle (steam cycle to use exhaust heat). > The methanation process has an efficiency around 65%. Together with a very > high combustion engine efficiency of 42.5%, you end up with a maximum > efficiency of a gasification-methanation-gas engine scheme of around 27.5%. > However, with considerably higher equipment cost. I definitely recommend not > to use a methanation step as fuel upgrading step but to use the syngas > directly in your engine. In any case, the world totally changes if you aim > at using high-temperature fuel cells, gas turbines or if you want to make > the wood energy transportable and storable. The latter was the idea of the > PSI methanation project given Switzerlands dependence on foreign gas > imports. > > Cheers > Florian > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]?> ] On Behalf Of Jim > Leach > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 15:51 > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > Jan, > I am curious what method you selected for tar removal. Also, was the > methanation step expensive? The methane would make a better engine fuel > than the H2 and CO but I am concerned about the cost. > > Best Regards, > > > > JAMES T. LEACH, P.E. > President > > DANA TECHNOLOGIES, INC. > 32242 Paseo Adelanto, Suite D > San Juan Capistrano, CA 92675 > Ph 949-496-6516 > Fx 949-496-8133 > Mobile 949-933-6518 > > > _____ > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]?> ] On Behalf Of Jan > Kopyscinski > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 1:13 PM > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > Hi Kevin, > > I did my Phd thesis on this topic. You can find more information there: > http://e-collection.library.ethz.ch/view/eth:1059 > > or under www.bio-sng.com <http://www.bio-sng.com/> and www.biosng.com > <http://www.biosng.com/> , http://www.biofuelstp.eu/bio-sng.html and on > other pages. > > In a nut shell the process consits of: > 1) low temperature steam gasification > 2) gas cleaning (ash, tar, H2S, ...) > 3) methanation = conversion of the syngas into methan (catalytic process, > mostly Nickelcatalyst) > CO + 3 H2 --> CH4 + H2O > CO + H2O --> H2 + CO2 > > If you use a different catalyst you can go for higher hydrocarbon such as > Fischer Tropsch Diesel, or Methanol, .... > > 4) Fuel upgrading = removal of H2O, CO2 > > We at the Paul Scherrer Institute in Switzerland (http://tpe.web.psi.ch/) > investigated this process from wood to BioSNG in two scales for more than > 1000h. > > Regards > > Jan > - > Dr. sc. Jan Kopyscinski > Postdoctoral fellow > Department of Chemical and Petroleum Engineering > Schulich School of Engineering > University of Calgary > 2500 University Drive NW > Calgary, Alberta, Canada T2N 1N4 > > Email: [email protected] > Phone: 001 403 2109575 > > > > > _____ > > Von: Kevin <[email protected]> > Gesendet: May 31, 2011 5:02:24 PM > An: "Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification" > <[email protected]> > Betreff: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > Dear Jan > > Very interesting!! > > What steam temperature and pressure is required to gasify wood? > > Once one has such gas, what sort processing is required to convert it to > CH4? (That is, what temperatures, pressures, catalysts, etc) > > Is there any way this can be done on a small scale? > > Is there any way this process can be modified to produce methanol on a small > scale? If so, this would be awesome... it would then yield a very portable > liquid fuel. > > Thanks! > > Kevin > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jan <mailto:[email protected]> Kopyscinski > To: Discussion of biomass <mailto:[email protected]> > pyrolysis and gasification > Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2011 11:30 AM > Subject: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > > Hi, > > First of all, there are at least two different types of biofuel: > First Generation: agricultural feedstock, which is converted by means of > biochemical processes (i.e., digestion) --> Biogas > Second Generation: woody biomass that is converted via thermochemical > converiosn into a producer or so-calles syngas (Gasification). > Thus, if your goal is to produce Methan or Natural Gas substite for a gas > engine or transportation fuel you have different options. But you need to > know what is your feedstock (dry , wet, digestable or not digestable such as > wood): > If you have a rather dry feedstock you can go for steam gasifiaction (no > air, means no Nitrogen). The produced syngas you can catalytilcally convert > to CH4, CO2 and H2O. Prior to the methanation process you need to remove the > sulphur since it is deactivating your catalyts. H2O and CO2 can then be > removed. This process has been investiaget by the Paul Scherrer Institiute > in Switzerland (www.psi.ch <http://www.psi.ch/> and www.bio-sng.com > <http://www.bio-sng.com/> ). > Removal of nitrogen is too expensive, thus you should avoid feeding it into > your process. 2 vol% to max 5vol% N2 in the methan rich gas is acceptable. > > Regards, > > Jan > > _____ > > Von: "Pannirselvam P.V" <[email protected]> > Gesendet: May 31, 2011 12:46:54 PM > An: "Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification" > <[email protected]> > Betreff: Re: [Gasification] back to gasification > > Dear A.D Karve > > One of the project we have been studying is based on the > IGT,Instuite Gas technology patented process called Biotherm , in which > the wood gas or syngqs can be passed into the biodigestor, in which CO > and Hydrogen can be converted into methane ; the NOX .COX, SOX removed > via simple known wet or dry process using activated charcoal and lime ; > the methane is then compressed.The N can be removed as ammonia,as this can > be very toxic to bio methane bacteria; Syngas obtained via pyrogas can > reduce this N2 problem and complexity.Thus pyrogas technology has more > potential than wood gas technology > > we are studying how to make this complex process into simple innovative > process to make possible charcoal and methane economy which is practiced > in the developed country in big scale can be made possible in developing > village level technology too in small scale ,The project is yet in design > stage to reduce CO2 to use as liquid fertilizer too increasing the > calorific valued the compressed biogas. > > Yours truely > Pannirselvam > > > On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 11:01 PM, Anand Karve <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear List, > We are already using, in India, wood gas made from agricultural waste > to run stationary internal combustion engines. But, for using it as > automobile fuel, it would have to be filled into cylinders, for which > the nitrogen in the wood gas would have to be removed in order to > reduce its bulk and to increase its calorfiic value. Does anybody have > a suggestion as to how this can be achieved? > Yours > A.D.Karve > > _______________________________________________ > Gasification mailing list > > to Send a Message to the list, use the email address > [email protected] > > to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenerg > ylists.org > > for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: > http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > -- > ************************************************ > P.V.PANNIRSELVAM > ASSOCIATE . PROF. > Research Group ,GPEC, Coordinator > Computer aided Cost engineering > > DEQ ? Departamento de Engenharia Qu?mica > CT ? Centro de Tecnologia / UFRN, Lagoa Nova ? 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CEP: 59.072-970 > North East,Brazil > ******************************************* > https://sites.google.com/a/biomassa.eq.ufrn.br/sites/ > and > http://ecosyseng.wetpaint.com/ > > > Fone ;Office > 84 3215-3769 , Ramal 210 > Home : 84 3217-1557 > > Mobile :558488145083 > > Email: > [email protected] > [email protected] > [email protected] > [email protected] > > > > > > _____ > > > _______________________________________________ > Gasification mailing list > > to Send a Message to the list, use the email address > [email protected] > > to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenerg > ylists.org > > for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: > http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > _____ > > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/> > Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3671 - Release Date: 05/31/11 > > > > __________ 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to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings > use the web page > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenerg > ylists.org for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: > http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 6174 (20110602) __________ > > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 6175 (20110602) __________ > > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > > http://www.eset.com > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110602/089ceac9/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 05:55:43 -0700 > From: "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> > To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" > <[email protected]> > Subject: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <000001cc21ed$8d466b70$a7d34250$@com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > TLUD-ites, > > > > Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered TLUD? > Continuous feed? > > > > Tom Miles > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/30529b99/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 09:15:47 -0400 > From: Thomas Reed <[email protected]> > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > TM > > Depends greatly on the sawdust particle size and moisture content. With > very coarse sawdust should work ok. > > With a small fan you may get no penetration. With a larger fan you are > likely to get a spouted of fluidized bed. > > Tom Reed > > Dr Thomas B Reed > President, The Biomass Energy Foundation > www.Woodgas.com > > On Jun 3, 2011, at 8:55 AM, "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> TLUD-ites, >> >> >> >> Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered TLUD? >> Continuous feed? >> >> >> >> Tom Miles >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/dea15b55/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 06:45:52 -0700 > From: jim mason <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Subject: [Gasification] APL Gasification and Biochar workshop in 2 > weeks, June 17-19 > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > *Father's Day Gasification and Biochar Workshop: June 17-19, 2011** > > Opening Intro & Lecture: Friday, June 17, 7:30 ? 9:30PM > Weekend Build, Run and Test: Saturday and Sunday, June 17-19, 11am ? 7pm* > > *Location: ALL Power Labs, 1010 Murray Street, Berkeley CA > 94710<http://www.gekgasifier.com/about/workshop/travel-and-accomodation/> > Cost: Free if you are a GEK or BEK owner, either through self build or > purchase. Otherwise, $100 for weekend*. > RSVP to the forum > here.<http://www.gekgasifier.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2145#post2145> > Buy > your spot here. <http://www.gekgasifier.com/about/workshop/sign-up/> > > > Our summer workshop is fast approaching- June 17th - 19th. Many of you > have already RSVP'ed and are flying in from the 4 corners, but there is > still room for more. So come join us for a quality Father's Day weekend of > wrenching, rotating machinery, and guided tour down the rabbit hole of > biomass thermal conversion. > > The workshop begins with a Friday evening talk on the science of > gasification and pyrolysis, and the new engineering solutions embodied in > the GEK gasifier and BEK biochar maker. Saturday and Sunday are full days > of building, running and testing the physical particulars. Come prepared to > get your hands dirty building and running machinery. We learn through both > talking and working. > > We'll have 4 projects going in parallel for this round of the workshop. You > can participate in all of them, and wander between them as desired. > > *1. 50 Hour Endurance run of the 10kw Power Pallet: > *Long proving runs of the Power Pallet continue on this end. This round > we'll do a total of 50 hours over several days. We have it on good > authority that it will not rain this time, and we'll be sure to have plenty > of reasonable fuel on hand before we start. We look forward to more refined > data on fuel consumption, gas composition, and feedback on general usability > from you kicking the tires over the weekend. Runs will start on Saturday > and continue into the early part of the following week. If you can't be > here, we'll have a webcam on the proceedings as usual. > > This test will use one of the current generation stainless steel Power > Pallets pictured here: http://www.gekgasifier.com/wpgallery/ > > *2. Demonstration runs of the 20kw Power Pallet:* > Those of you interested in the larger 20kw Power Pallet will can finally see > one in action over the weekend. There will also be 8 of the 20kw Power > Pallets under assembly in the APL factory, so you can see how we make them. > Things will look something like this, only bigger: > http://wiki.gekgasifier.com/w/file/40416596/batch2onthefloor.JPG. The > engineers and builders of these units will be on hand to answer questions > and explain the details. > > *3. GEK Gasifier Building: > *Want to build you own gasifier? Here's your chance to do it, using our > tools and with plenty of instruction from the local crew. > > This round of the workshop we're having a special GEK Level III building > clinic. We have tables and welders for 4 people who want to weld together a > kit over the weekend. Given clear inhouse instruction, you should be able > to get through the building process by the end of Sunday. Finished > gasifiers can Russian doll back into the hopper and filter for checking as > oversize baggage on the plane. Yes this does work. We do this regularly. > > Anyone who wants to do this will need to reserve a spot by purchasing a > Level III weld together GEK kit. There is no additional cost for > instruction, using our tools, and burning our welding wire. The workshop is > also free if you get a kit. We're trying to make this easy and accessible. > > Again, there are ONLY 4 slots for gasifier building. Welders are limited. > Please reserve ahead of time if you want to build a kit. > > > *4. BEK Biochar maker running: > * > We continue to have the BEK on hold while we focus on ramping up the Power > Pallet production. This has made quite a few people unhappy, as there is so > few small scale biochar making machines available at the moment. We're > trying to get back to making these as soon as possible, but in the meantime > we wanted to give the interested a chance to run our in house machine. > > We'll have the BEK on fire both Saturday and Sunday of the workshop. You > are welcome to bring your feedstock of interest and run it through. Or, you > can experiment with our variety of feedstocks on location. If you have some > you want to bring, please do write us beforehand so we can coordinate the > details. > > > * > General Info and Signup* > > The APL workshop series offers education, research reports and hands-on > experience to bring more people to successful operation of small scale > gasification and pyrolysis units. The event is open to everyone, not just > GEK or BEK users/owners. Worshops are free if you own a GEK or BEK by > either purchase or DIY build. Otherwise the weekend is $100, which helps to > cover food, drink and other consumables. > > If you want to join us, please RSVP to the forum thread here: > http://www.gekgasifier.com/forums/showthread.php?t=563 > > If you need to pay the workshop fee, you can do so via credit card here: > http://www.gekgasifier.com/about/workshop/sign-up/ > > Information on local accommodation, maps and airports is here: > http://www.gekgasifier.com/about/workshop/travel-and-accomodation/ > > > We look forward to seeing you here soon. > > jim > > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Jim Mason > Website: http://www.whatiamupto.com > Current Projects: > - Gasifier Experimenters Kit (the GEK): http://www.gekgasifier.com > - Escape from Berkeley alt fuels vehicle race: www.escapefromberkeley.com > - ALL Power Labs on Twitter: http://twitter.com/allpowerlabs > - Shipyard Announce list: > http://lists.spaceship.com/listinfo.cgi/icp-spaceship.com > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/292b1461/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Fri, 03 Jun 2011 08:46:26 -0500 > From: "Paul S. Anderson" <[email protected]> > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]>, Thomas Reed > <[email protected]> > Cc: Hugh McLaughlin <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: > <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; > format="flowed" > > Dear All, > > I totally agree with Tom Reed's comments (below). > > Particle size is subjective, and some people call sawdust what I would > call small shavings. If you can see the curl in the cut of the wood, > that material can probably be used in a Fan Assisted (FA) TLUD. I and > others have done that on experimental basis. > > I know of nobody focused on "sawdust" in TLUDs. Too much air could > create channels or what Tom R. called "spouted." > > At Chip Energy, Paul Wever and I have successfully used some mixtures > of sawdust with other larger-sized fuels, but not successfully with > 100% sawdust even when we used compressed air to be sure to be able to > blow through the fuel pile. > > To date, the only consistently successful "small particle" fuel in a > TLUD-FA is rice husks. That work is credited to Alexis Belonio in the > Philippines, and much further work by Paul Olivier in Vietnam. > > So, I suspect that wood particles as small as rice husks could be > successfully used in a TLUD-FA. But sawdust does not come in such > nicely uniform particles of that size. > > Somebody is asking. I hope we hear of their interests and experiences. > > I say frequently: We only know about 20% of what is available to be > learned about TLUD pyrolytic gasifier devices. There is so much yet > to do and learn. All are encouraged to join in these efforts. > > Paul > -- > Paul S. Anderson, PhD > Known to some as: Dr. TLUD Doc Professor > Phone (USA): 309-452-7072 SKYPE: paultlud Email: [email protected] > www.gtz.de/de/dokumente/giz2011-en-micro-gasification.pdf (Best ref.) > > > Quoting Thomas Reed <[email protected]>: > >> TM >> >> Depends greatly on the sawdust particle size and moisture content. >> With very coarse sawdust should work ok. >> >> With a small fan you may get no penetration. With a larger fan you >> are likely to get a spouted of fluidized bed. >> >> Tom Reed >> >> Dr Thomas B Reed >> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation >> www.Woodgas.com >> >> On Jun 3, 2011, at 8:55 AM, "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> TLUD-ites, >>> >>> >>> >>> Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered >>> TLUD? Continuous feed? >>> >>> >>> >>> Tom Miles >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Gasification mailing list >>> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>> [email protected] >>> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>> >>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > This message was sent using Illinois State University RedbirdMail > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 15:51:54 +0200 > From: Mikael Sj?blom <[email protected]> > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <ca0eb312.a52b%[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Or you can as we do, gasify fine sawdust in a cyclone reactor. > > > > Yours Sincererly > > Mikael Sjoblom > Marketing Director > > Meva Innovation AB > Sj?gatan 13, > S-852 34 Sundsvall > SWEDEN > Phone: + 46 (0)60 15 34 10 > Mobile: + 46 (0)70 572 73 30 > Internet: www.mevainnovation.se > E-mail: [email protected] > > ***************************************************** > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential > and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to > whom they are addressed. If you have received this email > in error please notify [email protected] > > This email message has been virus checked by the virus > programs used by Meva Group. > ***************************************************** > P Please consider the environment - do you really need to print this email? > > From: Tom Miles <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Reply-To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 14:55:43 +0200 > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Subject: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > TLUD-ites, > > Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered TLUD? > Continuous feed? > > Tom Miles > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/207fb2c1/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 07:26:52 -0700 > From: "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> > To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" > <[email protected]>, "'Thomas Reed'" > <[email protected]> > Cc: 'Hugh McLaughlin' <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <008c01cc21fa$4a1a4d00$de4ee700$@com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Sawdust size <6 mm to 8 mm > Sawdust moisture 10-20% MC > > Tom Miles > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Paul S. > Anderson > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 6:46 AM > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification; Thomas Reed > Cc: Hugh McLaughlin > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > Dear All, > > I totally agree with Tom Reed's comments (below). > > Particle size is subjective, and some people call sawdust what I would > call small shavings. If you can see the curl in the cut of the wood, > that material can probably be used in a Fan Assisted (FA) TLUD. I and > others have done that on experimental basis. > > I know of nobody focused on "sawdust" in TLUDs. Too much air could > create channels or what Tom R. called "spouted." > > At Chip Energy, Paul Wever and I have successfully used some mixtures > of sawdust with other larger-sized fuels, but not successfully with > 100% sawdust even when we used compressed air to be sure to be able to > blow through the fuel pile. > > To date, the only consistently successful "small particle" fuel in a > TLUD-FA is rice husks. That work is credited to Alexis Belonio in the > Philippines, and much further work by Paul Olivier in Vietnam. > > So, I suspect that wood particles as small as rice husks could be > successfully used in a TLUD-FA. But sawdust does not come in such > nicely uniform particles of that size. > > Somebody is asking. I hope we hear of their interests and experiences. > > I say frequently: We only know about 20% of what is available to be > learned about TLUD pyrolytic gasifier devices. There is so much yet > to do and learn. All are encouraged to join in these efforts. > > Paul > -- > Paul S. Anderson, PhD > Known to some as: Dr. TLUD Doc Professor > Phone (USA): 309-452-7072 SKYPE: paultlud Email: [email protected] > www.gtz.de/de/dokumente/giz2011-en-micro-gasification.pdf (Best ref.) > > > Quoting Thomas Reed <[email protected]>: > >> TM >> >> Depends greatly on the sawdust particle size and moisture content. >> With very coarse sawdust should work ok. >> >> With a small fan you may get no penetration. With a larger fan you >> are likely to get a spouted of fluidized bed. >> >> Tom Reed >> >> Dr Thomas B Reed >> President, The Biomass Energy Foundation >> www.Woodgas.com >> >> On Jun 3, 2011, at 8:55 AM, "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> TLUD-ites, >>> >>> >>> >>> Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered >>> TLUD? Continuous feed? >>> >>> >>> >>> Tom Miles >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Gasification mailing list >>> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>> [email protected] >>> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>> > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenerg > ylists.org >>> >>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > This message was sent using Illinois State University RedbirdMail > > > > _______________________________________________ > Gasification mailing list > > to Send a Message to the list, use the email address > [email protected] > > to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenerg > ylists.org > > for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: > http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 07:26:52 -0700 > From: "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> > To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" > <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <008d01cc21fa$4a72f450$df58dcf0$@com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Mikael, > > > > Your VIPP - Vortex Intensive Power Process looks interesting. There is not > much to see on your website. (http://www.mevainnovation.se/ ) Do you have > product and system brochures? Is this based on university research? > > > > I'd be interested to know what scale you have built, how long you have run > and what fuels you have gasified. The website says that you are targeting > 1-2 MWe. > > > > What are the fuel specifications? <6 MM? 10% MC? > > > > Can you handle high as fuels such as ground wheat straw? 4-8% ash with more > than 0.5 kg/GJ alkali (K20+Na2)? > > > > A system to handle ground straw would be very useful. Can you supply a > turnkey system for USD $3,000/kWe or less? > > > > Thanks > > > > Tom > > > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mikael > Sj?blom > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 6:52 AM > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > > > Or you can as we do, gasify fine sawdust in a cyclone reactor. > > > > > > Yours Sincererly > > Mikael Sjoblom > Marketing Director > > Meva Innovation AB > > Sj?gatan 13, > S-852 34 Sundsvall > SWEDEN > Phone: + 46 (0)60 15 34 10 > Mobile: + 46 (0)70 572 73 30 > Internet: www.mevainnovation.se > E-mail: [email protected] > > ***************************************************** > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential > and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to > whom they are addressed. If you have received this email > in error please notify [email protected] > > This email message has been virus checked by the virus > programs used by Meva Group. > ***************************************************** > P Please consider the environment - do you really need to print this email? > > > > From: Tom Miles <[email protected]> > Reply-To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]> > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 14:55:43 +0200 > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > <[email protected]> > Subject: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > > > TLUD-ites, > > > > Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered TLUD? > Continuous feed? > > > > Tom Miles > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/b7ed5745/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 16:40:36 +0200 > From: Mikael Sj?blom <[email protected]> > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <ca0ebeab.a539%[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Tom. > > I will give you a full spec of the VIPP system later today. But right now I > must run for my sons soccer training ;-) > > > > > > Yours Sincererly > > Mikael Sj?blom > Marketing Director > > [cid:6D9A1A8D-C3D8-46B6-9927-D23C64FA6503] > Sj?gatan 13, > S-852 34 Sundsvall > SWEDEN > Phone: + 46 (0)60 15 34 10 > Mobile: + 46 (0)70 572 73 30 > Internet: www.mevainnovation.se > E-mail: [email protected] > > ***************************************************** > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential > and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to > whom they are addressed. If you have received this email > in error please notify [email protected] > > This email message has been virus checked by the virus > programs used by Meva Group. > ***************************************************** > P Please consider the environment - do you really need to print this email? > > From: Tom Miles <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Reply-To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 16:26:52 +0200 > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > Mikael, > > Your VIPP - Vortex Intensive Power Process looks interesting. There is not > much to see on your website. (http://www.mevainnovation.se/ ) Do you have > product and system brochures? Is this based on university research? > > I'd be interested to know what scale you have built, how long you have run > and what fuels you have gasified. The website says that you are targeting > 1-2 MWe. > > What are the fuel specifications? <6 MM? 10% MC? > > Can you handle high as fuels such as ground wheat straw? 4-8% ash with more > than 0.5 kg/GJ alkali (K20+Na2)? > > A system to handle ground straw would be very useful. Can you supply a > turnkey system for USD $3,000/kWe or less? > > Thanks > > Tom > > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mikael > Sj?blom > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2011 6:52 AM > To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > Or you can as we do, gasify fine sawdust in a cyclone reactor. > > > > Yours Sincererly > > Mikael Sjoblom > Marketing Director > Meva Innovation AB > Sj?gatan 13, > S-852 34 Sundsvall > SWEDEN > Phone: + 46 (0)60 15 34 10 > Mobile: + 46 (0)70 572 73 30 > Internet: www.mevainnovation.se > E-mail: [email protected] > > ***************************************************** > This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential > and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to > whom they are addressed. If you have received this email > in error please notify [email protected] > > This email message has been virus checked by the virus > programs used by Meva Group. > ***************************************************** > P Please consider the environment - do you really need to print this email? > > From: Tom Miles <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Reply-To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 14:55:43 +0200 > To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> > Subject: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > > TLUD-ites, > > Does anyone have experience gasifying sawdust in a fan powered TLUD? > Continuous feed? > > Tom Miles > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/f8707ce5/attachment-0001.html> > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: 71A54733-55DE-4BC7-99EA-665827CA7980[10].png > Type: image/png > Size: 18974 bytes > Desc: 71A54733-55DE-4BC7-99EA-665827CA7980[10].png > URL: > <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20110603/f8707ce5/attachment-0001.png> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2011 11:01:15 -0500 > From: "Pete & Sheri" <[email protected]> > To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" > <[email protected]>, "'Thomas Reed'" > <[email protected]> > Cc: 'Hugh McLaughlin' <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Sawdust in Fan TLUD > Message-ID: <000f01cc2207$7842a210$68c7e630$@net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Could one possibly semi-pelletize the sawdust directly at the input to the > gasifier? I see pellet makers that use a screw extrusion method. If one > could get enough compaction to loosely hold the particles together, right at > the input point, then there wouldn't be the "spouting" discussed previously. > There also wouldn't be all that pressurized air to deal with. The compacted > material would also create a "seal" between the gasifier and the outside > world, if needed. > > Pete Stanaitis > -------------- > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Gasification mailing list > > to Send a Message to the list, use the email address > [email protected] > > to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > > for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: > http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > End of Gasification Digest, Vol 10, Issue 4 > ******************************************* > _______________________________________________ Gasification mailing list to Send a Message to the list, use the email address [email protected] to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/
