Re: g_b Warning for gays ..(attn Mr. Messenger)

[A B]

Mr. Messenger,     Please get your facts statistics and arguments right. They are so many lacunas and ambiguities in every statement you have written in here! Let me adress each point as I go down.     1) Gay people are the minority, the oppressed, the victims here.   They are not hurting anyone by living life the way they are, because, they cant help themselves. Its not like they have a choice. They can’t develop sexual
 interest in the opposite sex. It’s not a moral question. It’s not like, I can rob a bank or I can work honestly. It’s like being born as African-American. He was, is and will be black. Even if he acts speaks and mimics all mannerisms of the white man, the world will still see him as black. I am not black so I will never understand what it feels like to be black. But I can empathize with him. If you are not gay, I don’t expect you to understand what it feels like to be gay. But if you have any compassion inside you, try and understand me and my lifestyle before pointing a finger.     2) (A) Homosexuality is not a cause for Prostitution  Prostitution like
 Burglary, Theft is because of unequal distribution of wealth or because of lustful and lecherous tendencies in people. So let me ask you, how many prostitutes have you tried to rescue? If you care about the marital well being of such women, tell me what have you done so far to help them? Easy to sit near the shore and give long winded sermons about storms, isn’t it?  (B) Homosexuality is not a cause for Women sleeping around  Once again, extra marital affairs and pre marital affairs happen because women feel they are being neglected or ignored or whatever. Don’t you think it’s ridiculous to assume that all of these women who are prowling the pubs for one night stands are all wives and girlfriends of gay people? I mean, then, the gay people would have been in majority as compared to
 heterosexuals. But gay people are a minority. So logically speaking, the fornicating women in eternal search of potential paramours for the purpose of sinful copulation are not essentially married to gay men who ignore their sexual advances in the marital bed.     3) AIDS  If AIDS is a punishment for the gay community then how come Lesbian Women are at the lowest risk of getting infected by HIV? I mean how can AIDS be a punishment for gay men only? While the gay women are shielded from this much-dreaded disease. Please, Messenger, use your head. AIDS is a disease, caused by a virus. It’s not the proverbial plague. Even a doctor (who is considered as a noble person
 because he saves lives), can get AIDS because of his contact with an HIV positive patient, in his line of duty. Even a newborn baby can get infected.  If AIDS was meant as a punishment for sinning gay men only then How come doctors are at a high risk of catching the disease? I am also interested to know what explanation do you have for the HIV positive new-born babies.  Please re-think your argument that AIDS is caused by gay sex. AIDS is caused by lack of awareness and protection. Please visit some hospital in your local area and work with HIV positive patients for just one day, some of them are innocent kids. You can do more good that way and the smile of satisfaction on your face when you see them smile will be a reward in itself.     4) Sin  Every man is a sinner. No man is free from sin. God and God alone is immaculate. You seem to have a deep knowledge of religion. The concept of sin is debatable and open to more than one interpretation. Mr. Messenger even you are a sinner. So how come you get to judge us? Why don’t you tell us all the times who have sinned against God and against the men he has created? Level with us and let this be a platform of equal opportunity for both parties to judge each other. Hiding behind an angelic alias "Messenger" and preaching from a distance is easy. To be us and understanding our problems you have to live life wearing our shoes. So please don’t talk about Sin. Its not as generic as you make it out to be.  
    There are extraneous circumstances where even a carcass of an animal which has been dead can be fed on to a person starving from hunger for 3 days. That doesn’t mean a man who is starving for 2 days and comes across such a carcass, has to wait for 12 more hours to eat it. Does it? (-Courtesy my Luwerdude)     Sin is an individualistic and situational concept. You can’t interpret Sin in the strict sense of the term every time. Use your discretion and logic.         5) ABUSE and MOLESTATION     The analogy that you are drawing between practicing consensual homosexuality and committing rape or sexual-abuse and molestation is wrong.      Do you think only gay men abuse, rape and molest innocent people? Even heterosexual men are capable of and do such awful things.      So if heterosexual people get pleasure from rape, abuse and molestation, then by
 your logic, even heterosexuality is a sin! Right?      Your argument that "if it gives pleasure its a sin" is terribly flawed. Even eating delicious food gives me pleasure. Does that mean, every time I take a bite of paneer kadahi, chicken tandoori or malai kofta, I am being a sinner! If I don’t eat I am gonna starve and die! That will amount to suicide. And willful suicide is also a sin!      Please try and use some logic in your statements.      6) Why are you
 here?  Let me ask you something. If there are so many sins... things that are prohibited by religion and God,   "Why did you choose to concentrate on sins of a sexual( and specifically homosexual) nature?"     Why that need to come in here and quote holy scripture?     Do you think you can influence public opinion in this group in this manner? You want to know how you come across to the people in here. We see you as
 an outsider, as a religious fanatic who is hell-bent on preaching religion. We don’t think you can understand us and we don’t trust you! We feel more victimized by your "holier-than-thou" stand against homosexuality. How can you expect us to listen to you or understand you or even be influenced by what you are saying if you don’t understand us first?      Whats more important is that you are creating a  wrong image of the Muslim people. Thats where I come in. I have been in love with a Muslim man for a long time. He is deeply religious but he is not a fundamentalist. He is the kind of person we all meet on the streets... The Muslim next door neighbour we exhange our kitchen dishes and foodies-goodies with. He is very gentle and very open as a person. What you are doing is tarnishing the
 image of Muslim people. You are showing a Muslim guy as an inolerant religious freak. That may be true about some people but not all Muslim men are like that. You are hurting us as a couple. Please stop.     And if you are so intent on spreading "awareness", shouldn’t you formulate a better strategy than bombarding us with your impressive knowledge of religious text? For a change go back and read history, even real wars were lost because of weak strategies! You approach is WRONG. Think about it!        With this pious attitude you have merely succeeded in antagonizing this group. You need to analyze your
 moves and be gentler in your approach.       If you want to create awareness there are more sophisticated ways to do that. For example you can find sponsors and start a charitable trust to help the LGBT community. You open your arms for us, then we open our ears and hearts for you. That is how it works. There is no force in Islam. You of all people should know that.      Let me tell you something else. My name Aman is a gift. It is not a coincidence that Aman and Islam mean the same thing. For, they both mean PEACE. Think about this.    
 And unless you can be more factual, practical and can forward well researched, relevant and lucid arguments, pls don’t waste our time. God be with you.     Peace.  Aman. B       Messenger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:    sriram dasa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: as long as you are not guilty for anything, and you know you are not hurting the other person involved in the act     Yes
 gays are hurting a lot of people specially women badly. They are creating a disbalance between the ratio of men and women. They are causing problems in the society.  When women are short of partners , they have no choice but to become public property which leads to degrade women and even spread of diseases like AID.     Allah created men and women for some purpose.      What gays are doing is definitely a big SIN.      Like some people who find pleasure in molestation and child-abuse are sinners, that does not mean that they are doing the right thing because it has pleasure.     ~Messenger.   
		How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger’s low  PC-to-Phone call rates.





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