On Nov 21, 2006, at 4:02 PM, Yoav Shapira wrote:
Hi,
On 11/21/06, Curt Arnold <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Per the project bylaws (http://logging.apache.org/site/bylaws.html),
it appears that both a subproject (described in the actions section)
and PMC vote (second paragraph after Committers) are required to
grant new commit rights. This message is to inform the PMC of the
results of the subproject vote and to initiate a PMC vote to confirm
the log4j vote.
This is kind of surprising. I thought the bylaws say lazy consensus
of the PMC, not a formal vote, so all that was required is a message
from one of the log4j committers to the logging PMC saying "hey, we've
voted this guy in, so unless you have any objections, please send an
email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] asking for his account..."
But if a vote is required, here's my +1 again.
The description of "Lazy Consensus" in the bylaws says that it
requires "3 binding +1 votes", so I don't see how you could have a
Lazy Consensus of PMC members without having a call for a vote by
that definition. The definition of "Lazy Consensus" is different at
http://www.apache.org/foundation/glossary.html#LazyConsensus.
However, as all the log4j votes were from PMC members and the only
abstaining PMC members (Mark and Ceki) have been quiet for a while,
it should be a only a formality.
On a separate note, we should remove these bylaws altogether. We just
had a discussion about this on [EMAIL PROTECTED] (see
http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=incubator-
general&m=116405409724466&w=2
for the key message). Apparently project-level bylaws, like
Jakarta's from which we copied ours, are invalid in the formal sense
that we seem to be applying them here.
Yoav
I could support that. I've proposed modifying the bylaws a few years
ago to streamline the double votes required for releases among other
things. Eliminating the project bylaws altogether would likely
accomplish all the benefits that a streamlining would and would
eliminate the possibilities for conflicts between LS definitions and
ASF definitions. I think it would essentially make everything
requiring a vote (like a release) a single PMC vote. Let's make it
open for discussion for a little while and if it still seems like a
good idea, let's put it to a PMC vote.
