FWIW what I've heard from packagers over the years is that Hadrian is an
unwanted pain point for them.

On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 7:10 PM Andreas Klebinger via ghc-devs <
[email protected]> wrote:

> I'm curious about this. I don't think I ever cared *that* much about the
> no-op time.
>
> I cared a little a few weeks back and found ways to make hadrians no-op
> runtime ~25% shorter in relatively little time.
> Little enough time to have a suspicion others also don't care all that
> much ;-) And there is still low hanging fruit left to pluck.
>
> I would be more curious about experiences people have with packaging
> software using buck2. As that has been a pain point
> that come up repeatedly over the years. That being said not sure if
> packagers would more happy to see hadrian go, or annoyed
> to have to adjust how to package ghc yet again.
> On 19/10/2026 16:35, Sebastian Graf via ghc-devs wrote:
>
> Great!! FWIW, I would be more than happy to adjust to some inconveniences
> if no-ops become this cheap again.
>
> Am Mo., 19. Okt. 2026 um 16:18 Uhr schrieb Simon Marlow <
> [email protected]>:
>
>> On Mon, 19 Oct 2026 at 15:12, Sebastian Graf <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Simon,
>>>
>>> Thanks for doing this. If my suspicion is correct and the time it takes
>>> to do no-op rebuilds / single test runs is just half as slow as with
>>> hadrian, then this will improve the manual development experience on GHC a
>>> lot. Not that I'm building GHC much these days, much less so manually...
>>>
>>
>> No-op rebuild:
>>
>>    - Hadrian: 7.36s
>>    - Buck2: 0.02s
>>
>> caveats apply, Hadrian is also checking the .cabal files for changes
>> whereas with Buck2 you currently have to re-run ./generate-buck2.hs if you
>> modify a .cabal file.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Simon
>>
>>
>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Sebastian
>>>
>>> Am Mo., 19. Okt. 2026 um 16:07 Uhr schrieb Simon Marlow via ghc-devs <
>>> [email protected]>:
>>>
>>>> As I mentioned to a few people recently, I wanted to explore replacing
>>>> Hadrian with Buck2. I've got a prototype to the point where it can build
>>>> the stage2 compiler and all the libraries on Linux:
>>>>
>>>> > buck2 run :stage2-ghc -- --interactive
>>>> GHCi, version 10.1.20261017: https://www.haskell.org/ghc/  :? for help
>>>> Using default language edition: GHC2024
>>>> ghci> 1+2
>>>> 3
>>>> ghci>
>>>>
>>>> This includes dynamic/static, all the RTS ways and profiling is
>>>> allegedly working although I haven't tested it very much.
>>>>
>>>> It's a LOT smaller than Hadrian - hard to say exactly how much because
>>>> some of the code is in the shared projects cabal-buck2 and haskell-buck2,
>>>> but there's about 1400 lines of Buck2 stuff in the ghc repo and nothing in
>>>> the library submodules.
>>>>
>>>> I've written up the design along with some notes on how to set it up
>>>> and try it over here:
>>>> https://github.com/simonmar/ghc/blob/buck2/README.buck2.md
>>>>
>>>> Keen to hear what people think about this. Are there key metrics that
>>>> we should measure to understand whether it's better than Hadrian? What are
>>>> the workflow aspects that people find slow currently?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers
>>>> Simon
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>>>>
>>>
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-- 
brandon s allbery kf8nh
[email protected]
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