http://blog.snaplogic.org/?p=65
------- Eben Moglen Whacks Tim OReilly! Posted 24 July, 2007 by Chris in Open Source, GPL I was at the OSCON Execuitive Breifing today and was looking forward to hearing Eben Moglen speak about Open Source licensing issues. The GPLv3 was recently released and a draft of the Affero license is open for comments. I think the GPLv3 is a good but flawed license, and the Affero license in its current form is a complete joke. It seemed like rich fodder for an interesting discussion. I really like Eben. Ive heard him speak several times and hes often the smartest man in the room. Today, however, I think it must have been Ebens doppleganger because he whacked Tim OReilly. In front of more than 100 people! It was embarrassing. It started the minute he sat down. At first I thought it was simply old friends giving each other a hard time but soon it was clear that Eben had an agenda and was using the venue to make his point. I dont have any problem with a speaker having a point of view and arguing it vigorously, but when it turns personal and vitriolic theyve clearly cross the line. I think this was clear to the audience as well. How else could you intrepret statements like: You spend to much time with your billionaire friends Youve wasted the past 10 years trying to make money while freedoms are under attack This Web 2.0 stuff is silly, thermal noise And lots of other zingers that I cant remember (comment or send me an email, please). They were said not in a casual, ironic sort of way, but in a thoughtful, pointed downright mean spirited way. I felt uncomfortable just listening to the conversation and it was clear that many in the room felt the same way. Tim was a gracious host and gave his invited guest his full attention and asked how he could help address the issues, at which time Eben replied Take down your name (the large OReilly sign behind the stage) and start promoting freedoms. Tim was speechless (or so it seemed). What bothered me most about Eben diatribe was the outrageous duplicity expressed in his rhetoric and the actions of the FSF regarding the ASP loophole in the GPLv3. I even asked him about this. I told him his rhetoric seems hollow given how the ASP loophole could have been a big step forward in addressing some of the concerns he has. I know better than to argue with Eben about any of this, but his response seem myopic and self serving. He basically said that closing the loophole would infringe on certain peoples rights and he didnt see any way to preserve everyones rights, so they left that problem for another day. Which is a total cop out. Rights are in conflict everywhere we look, but that doesnt mean we dont have laws that favor some rights over others. Look at our tax code! Heck, thats what our judicial system is for; to resolve these kinds of conflicts. The GPL is a friggin license, not a policy statement. They could put whatever they wanted in there. If Ebens fears loom as large as he says they do, he should have acted upon them using the single biggest tool he had at his disposal, but no, he chose not to. Rather, he chose to ambush Tim OReilly. ------- In his later posting Chris elaborated: http://blog.snaplogic.org/?p=66 (More on Eben and Open Source Licenses) ------- Lost in the discussion (here <http://blog.snaplogic.org/?p=65>, here <http://www.oreillynet.com/conferences/blog/2007/07/oreilly_radar_executive_briefi.html>, here <http://www.linux.com/feature/118201> and here <http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/07/26/oreilly_moglen_oscon/>) on Eben Moglens session with Tim OReilly on Licensing in the Web 2.0 Era was what was actually discussed. Tim believes that since the world is rapidly headed toward a more centralized computing model with power and control maintained by the on-line services like Google, eBay, Amazon, Salesforce, Facebook, MySpace, Flickr, etc. (i.e. Web 2.0), Open Source licenses dont matter much anymore. Eben, on the other hand believes that the pendulum is swinging the other way toward individuals controlling more and more of their own on-line activity and therefore licenses matter very much. He further believes the consolidation we see happening today is merely an aberration that will correct itself once we all realize the control these services hold is dangerous and threatening to our freedoms and we systematically reject them. Fundamental to Ebens argument is that we have the power to reject them because: 1) Todays laptop computers have capabilities of the most powerful supercomputer of 20 years ago and, 2) Free software will provide the means by which this will be possible. Therefore, since the compute problem is being pushed out to the endpoints (i.e. users), and not gravitating toward the center (i.e. services), licenses do matter. Matter a lot. Implicit in this argument, I believe, is that since we have the power, we also have the desire and skill and will also take action. I say implicit because we never really did get down to this level of detail in the session. Hes more eloquent and convincing on these points than my simple description, but independent of these other factors, Moores law trajectory is one of the major tenets of his argument. I am not convinced. I strongly believe that in the future (1, 3, 5, 10 yrs??) there will be more centralization of services/data/info, not less. The trend we are seeing today is not an aberration, but a secular shift in computing. None of Ebens arguments sway me on this. In particular, his Moores Law argument is completely specious. The premise that the growth in compute supply (i.e. CPU performance) shifts the equilibrium toward the edge would be more convincing if there was some mention of the compute demand. Unfortunately, I have yet to hear Eben mention even once the effect of compute demand. Empirical and anecdotal evidence suggests that demand has outstripped supply and has indeed shifted the equilibrium, but toward a more centralized compute model, undermining a major element of Ebens thesis. Yes, my laptop is a 2GHz, 2GB dual core device thats 1,000 times more powerful than early super computers, but today Ive also got a Terra Byte of data that Ive got to manage. Thats 1,000,000 times the data that I had to manage on my computer from 20 years ago. Im getting buried under three orders of magnitude more data. HELP!!!!! Advances in software might make it feel like only two orders of magnitude, but it still hurts. A lot. ------- regards, alexander. -- "Mathematics is primarily a language for ensuring reliable results in human social activity. " -- Columbia Professor Eben Anarcho-Dot Communist Moglen _______________________________________________ gnu-misc-discuss mailing list [email protected] http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnu-misc-discuss
