I am not making this argument but you are continuously referring to experienced developer's preferences (perhaps someone else more if so I am sorry).
Don't get me wrong. Experience is good and weigh a lot especially combined with education and wits. Perhaps we can both concede that there are such developers in both camps. On Mon, Jul 1, 2019, 19:21 Robert Engels <reng...@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > > I don't think that has anything to do with what I said. > > I stated that experienced developers with minimal Go experience can > probably offer deeper insights than new developers with only Go experience. > > The Go team is experienced developers (at least the ones I know), AND have > deep Go experience (I am assuming - but maybe not on the Go application vs > internal development side). > > If you are making the claim that the Go team "knows all", then why even > have these conversations in the first place? Why have any community > involvement at all? I am pretty sure this is not the position of the "Go > team". > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henrik Johansson > Sent: Jul 1, 2019 12:14 PM > To: robert engels > Cc: David Suarez , golang-nuts > Subject: Re: [go-nuts] Re: The "leave "if err != nil" alone?" > anti-proposal > > This is funny since you are perfectly describing the Go core team... ;) > > I really can't get my head around it that this topic generates so much > vitriol (maybe harsh). > Generics I kinda get but this is just incredible. > Don't like try? Don't use it. > > On Mon, Jul 1, 2019, 18:42 Robert Engels <reng...@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > >> I think that is going to suffer greatly from sampling bias. >> >> You may have an engineer with 20+ years of programming in a variety of >> languages - using both exceptions, and error values, and be new to Go, but >> still have substantial insight as to the relative merits and drawbacks of >> proposed options. >> >> In fact, I would argue that it is these experienced engineers that can >> foretell the "end result" of various paths with far greater accuracy than a >> new developer with multiple years of nothing but Go experience. >> >> Nothing is new, it is an impedance matching exercise. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: David Suarez >> Sent: Jul 1, 2019 11:16 AM >> To: golang-nuts >> Subject: [go-nuts] Re: The "leave "if err != nil" alone?" anti-proposal >> >> The number of posts on this topic piqued my curiosity so I hope to add >> some considerations after doing some research on this trail that I hope you >> find useful. >> >> TL;DR: It is possible that the reason for the interest in improving >> "exception handling" in the proposed way is driven by individuals that are >> not yet fully comfortable in the language >> >> From what I have gathered, the reason for improving this area was due to >> a Go Survey. This reminds me of this popular quote: >> Quote. “*If* I had *asked* people what *they wanted*, *they* would have >> said faster horses.” Henry Ford, Innovation, >> >> Please note that while I did not participate in the survey, I would >> probably have said the same thing until I got "used to it". The >> interesting support bit from the survey was the answer to, "I have used Go >> for..." - suggests that 1/3rd of the respondents have only 1 year >> experience or less with the language and a full half have less than 2 years >> experience. In my experience, when I started Go I was (and still am in some >> cases) using some Java paradigms in them that make sense to me which is >> great for transition but may not be great for the language long run >> >> I am sure folks that have been around a while would agree that some of >> the reasons they are considering or actively changing languages tend to be >> due to bloat and unnecessary features that eventually weigh down >> productivity because there are 10 ways to skin the cat and everyone has a >> different opinion due to either how the rest of the code base does it or >> what is new. >> >> The large response to this thread suggests that potentially there may be >> a better feature out there that merits some attention and I would suggest >> it may be something that should come from the 2+ years experience crowd (if >> weighting of the results is possible) as those are likely the challenges >> that newbies like me will eventually encounter. Weighing the survey >> results by experience may help Go stay ahead of the curve. Just my .02 >> >> ** Side note: I am a relative newcomer to Go (~8-9 months) so there is >> likely some bias there from my newness. Add salt here.... >> >> On Friday, June 28, 2019 at 7:44:01 PM UTC-5, Tyler Compton wrote: >>> >>> If anyone hasn't seen it, an issue with the "proposal" tag was created >>> earlier on the Go issue tracker titled "Proposal: leave "if err != nil" >>> alone?" (here <https://golang.org/issues/32825>). This issue seems to >>> have resonated with a lot of people, which may be an important data point >>> when considering the try proposal <https://golang.org/issues/32437>, >>> but I was surprised to see how poorly the discussion has gone. There are >>> quite a few "me too" comments, a few image-only posts, some less than >>> stellar personal conduct, and overall not a lot of nuanced discussion. I >>> feel that perhaps these kinds of anti-proposals should be discouraged >>> because they're inherently reactionary, which seems to get the discussion >>> off on the wrong foot. >>> >>> That said, this anti-proposal attracted a whole new group of Go users >>> that I don't remember from the original try proposal discussion, which was >>> mostly dominated by ten or twenty participants. The discussion was better, >>> but the number of active users was much smaller. I wonder if there's a way >>> to better engage a larger portion of the Go user base while still >>> encouraging healthy, technical discussion. >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "golang-nuts" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/golang-nuts/1284af52-5fd6-4cd0-9bd3-cc69fd1c2fc7%40googlegroups.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/golang-nuts/1284af52-5fd6-4cd0-9bd3-cc69fd1c2fc7%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "golang-nuts" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/golang-nuts/974016176.5469.1561999325924%40wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/golang-nuts/974016176.5469.1561999325924%40wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "golang-nuts" group. 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