Have you setup breakpoints when it is setting the NetworkOrigin and stepped through the code to find out why the server vectors are not properly being set?
ASW Might be using a default proxy that is causing the server vectors to fail. That is where I'd start. On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 1:09 AM, Psy_Commando <psycomma...@gmail.com> wrote: > That's ok, I'm not expecting you to mess with it and fix it for me. I'm > just a little frustrated right now, I've been messing with that problem for > a long time, and it just seems like there's no solutions. So I just keep > posting what I noticed in hope someone will recognize the problem. > > With that said, I already followed your advices, but even when I keep the > bare minimum it still does it, every time I make a new test vehicle from > scratch it does the same thing. And sometimes when exiting the vehicle the > player does it too. > > Also I converted the vehicle back to orangebox, and it doesn't jitter on > OB. So it must be something with the settings in ASW I guess. The server > red cross shakes as much, but the view and the client entity is steady. ( > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXaLVWcZZDg&feature=youtu.be) > > > On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 2:21 AM, Tony "omega" Sergi <omegal...@gmail.com>wrote: > >> Like i said in the first place.. it's only simulating properly on ONE >> SIDE. which is why you're jittering. >> I'm sorry I don't have time to actually play with it for you, but if you >> listen to me that should get you on the right track. >> the client side is running it's update code as it should, but the server >> is not moving. so the client is "fighting" with the networked values. >> >> >> On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 1:40 PM, Psy_Commando <psycomma...@gmail.com>wrote: >> >>> *I meant in MP with predictions off >>> >>> >>> On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 12:39 AM, Psy_Commando <psycomma...@gmail.com>wrote: >>> >>>> I'm starting to think something on the server is messing with the >>>> server-side position.. >>>> >>>> I ran the code in MP , and noticed that the clientside position was >>>> steady, while the server-side pos was jittering. >>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5w3dT7F6Q4&feature=youtu.be >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 4:46 PM, Psy_Commando <psycomma...@gmail.com>wrote: >>>> >>>>> Oh, and did I mention that the Hl2 buggy does the same thing ? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 9:15 PM, Psy_Commando >>>>> <psycomma...@gmail.com>wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Well I didn't change much from the ES code, I just cut the useful >>>>>> parts, and tweaked them to fit the vehicle code I had. So yeah, its >>>>>> pretty >>>>>> much the same thing they did, but I'm guessing maybe it was written that >>>>>> way to fix bug they had with the old prediction system, so that might >>>>>> explain why it doesn't work in my case. >>>>>> >>>>>> Also, since I want this to work in multiplayer, I have to have it >>>>>> shared between client/server. If its only server side the controls will >>>>>> be >>>>>> laggy, and if its client side, it will be difficult to update the >>>>>> position >>>>>> on other clients. >>>>>> >>>>>> I already did override the GetRenderOrigin method and copied the >>>>>> smoothing code for the player in there. The problem is that it works only >>>>>> if there are prediction errors detected, and it detects none. >>>>>> >>>>>> I think you're not far with the truth by saying it might be a battle >>>>>> between smoothing and simulation. One odd thing I noticed, is that when I >>>>>> run the game with maxplayer to 1, it runs only the server code, and the >>>>>> jitter is still there... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Joel R. <joelru...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I'd start from scratch again. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Quick question though... Are the ships in Eternal Silence updating >>>>>>> the client entity position and angles as you are? Or is it server side >>>>>>> only...? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On the flip side... I would create my own custom clientside entity. >>>>>>> This way YOU control everything that happens to it, and not the server, >>>>>>> because it appears like you are battling with the prediction system. If >>>>>>> the origin/angles are off by a small tolerance (defined in >>>>>>> c_baseentity.cpp), the client will teleport immediately to the server >>>>>>> values. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Also, for the smoothing, I'd override the GetRenderOrigin and >>>>>>> GetRenderAngles functions. This way you can display a smoothed >>>>>>> origin/angles, but the simulation origin and angles are still simulated >>>>>>> perfectly. This may be another reason why you are getting jitter, >>>>>>> because >>>>>>> of the battle between smoothing and simulation. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 2:39 PM, Psy_Commando <psycomma...@gmail.com >>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Finally got the dedicated server to work with my local network ip. >>>>>>>> It does the same thing as with net_fakelag on the listen server, it >>>>>>>> doesn't >>>>>>>> look broken to me... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Still can't find what part of the code is causing the stuttering... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 10:43 AM, Ben Pye <bfh...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> With the dedicated server run with the argument "-ip 127.0.0.1" >>>>>>>>> and then it should listen on localhost. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 12:36 AM, Psy_Commando < >>>>>>>>> psycomma...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> You're sure about that ? you're the first person to tell me that. >>>>>>>>>> Besides, I can't connect to a dedicated server on the same >>>>>>>>>> machine for some reasons, it just timeouts, whether I use 127.0.0.1 >>>>>>>>>> or my >>>>>>>>>> local network IP. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 5:09 PM, Stephen Swires < >>>>>>>>>> stephen.swi...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Like I said. Fake lag does not work properly on listen servers >>>>>>>>>>> in ASW. You can check for any lag prediction issues by creating a >>>>>>>>>>> local >>>>>>>>>>> dedicated server and connecting to it, then fake lag works as >>>>>>>>>>> intended. >>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 28, 2012 8:32 PM, "Psy_Commando" <psycomma...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I made some progress changing the base class's base class to >>>>>>>>>>>> CBaseAnimating instead of CPhysicsPropMultiplayer, it fixed some >>>>>>>>>>>> of the >>>>>>>>>>>> stuttering, but once you add lag with net_fakelag it does it >>>>>>>>>>>> again. I can't >>>>>>>>>>>> find the reason why the origin differs between client and server >>>>>>>>>>>> though, at >>>>>>>>>>>> a glance it looks like the client is slightly ahead in time >>>>>>>>>>>> compared to the >>>>>>>>>>>> server. >>>>>>>>>>>> If it can help, here's the base class : >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Client : >>>>>>>>>>>> c_prop_sfr_vehicle.h - http://pastebin.com/tqUFNGQZ >>>>>>>>>>>> c_prop_sfr_vehicle.cpp -http://pastebin.com/eCKcE3VX >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Server : >>>>>>>>>>>> prop_sfr_vehicle.h - h <http://goog_156218657> >>>>>>>>>>>> http://pastebin.com/zPb3HbEh >>>>>>>>>>>> prop_sfr_vehicle.cpp - http://pastebin.com/5y1m0S89 >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 11:18 AM, Joel R. >>>>>>>>>>>> <joelru...@gmail.com>wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Nick, if you knew anything about coding, you'd be able to make >>>>>>>>>>>>> it work fairly quickly. He is not going to give you all the SDK >>>>>>>>>>>>> code >>>>>>>>>>>>> prepped and ready. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 11:17 PM, Nick <xnicho...@gmail.com>wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The code you posted certainly is impressive. I just can't >>>>>>>>>>>>>> find an easy >>>>>>>>>>>>>> way to put it in a sdk and run it? How to spawn the vech? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Make an sdk with the files included that works, (with a >>>>>>>>>>>>>> working copy >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the mod) and all of the code and send a link to valve.. I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> am sure >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they will help out. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> A single file isn't at all helpful compared to a working >>>>>>>>>>>>>> source code >>>>>>>>>>>>>> copy, and actual files and a 10 step list to "test" the exact >>>>>>>>>>>>>> problem >>>>>>>>>>>>>> you are experiencing. WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO RUN THE EXACT >>>>>>>>>>>>>> CODE IF U >>>>>>>>>>>>>> WANT ANY HELP ON SUCH A MASSIVE "PROBLEM".. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:18 AM, Psy_Commando < >>>>>>>>>>>>>> psycomma...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > I already posted a link to the pastebin with the whole code >>>>>>>>>>>>>> earlier ( >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > http://pastebin.com/eMcKh1YL ). And who at valve would >>>>>>>>>>>>>> help ? Most of the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > time I don't get answers when I mail devs. And what do you >>>>>>>>>>>>>> mean share what >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > the problem is with you, isn't it what I've been foing? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Is there any examples of simple moving predicted entities, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> besides the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > player ? I could really use an example... >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > By the way, is what Stephen says accurate ? Is the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> net_fakelag command not >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > working on listen servers ? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > On Thu, Apr 26, 2012 at 12:34 AM, Nick <xnicho...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> i think you should give us a basic code, and send it to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> valve... only >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> valve can help you. Usually valve is quite nice, and I am >>>>>>>>>>>>>> sure they >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> wouldn't mind helping you out, as long as you can share >>>>>>>>>>>>>> what the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> problem is with the rest of us..... >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> On Sun, Apr 22, 2012 at 3:04 PM, Psy_Commando < >>>>>>>>>>>>>> psycomma...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > Alright, what else could be causing jittering ? There is >>>>>>>>>>>>>> so little going >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > on >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > in that entity. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 8:40 PM, Tony "omega" Sergi >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > <omegal...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> As I said. looking at your prediction dump, it's not >>>>>>>>>>>>>> actually >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> predicting >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> properly. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> Either they're not updating at the same rate, or >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they're not running >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> same code producing the same results. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> see your screenshot: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13343993/abox0003.jpg >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> notice in red, velocity is 0 0 0 that means >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> disabling VPhysicsUpdate is not the solution, as that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> means you break >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> every vphysics object. Look at what it's doing, it's >>>>>>>>>>>>>> getting it's >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> position >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> after vphysics simulates and updating the entity. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> so unless you're trying to make a purely >>>>>>>>>>>>>> client-authoritive ship, you >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> can't disable that without adding code to update the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> position from the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> client. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> On Sun, Apr 22, 2012 at 7:40 AM, Stephen Swires >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> <stephen.swi...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> It maybe worth mentioning that net_fakelag is broken >>>>>>>>>>>>>> on listen servers >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> Alien Swarm. It works on dedicated, however >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 10:05 PM, Psy_Commando < >>>>>>>>>>>>>> psycomma...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> I found what was causing the stuttering with 0 ping >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> singleplayer. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> I disabled this code in cbaseentity_shared : >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> //----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> // Purpose: My physics object has been updated, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> react or extract >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> data >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> //----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> void CBaseEntity::VPhysicsUpdate( IPhysicsObject >>>>>>>>>>>>>> *pPhysics ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> switch( GetMoveType() ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> case MOVETYPE_VPHYSICS: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> if ( GetMoveParent() ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> Log_Warning( LOG_DEVELOPER_VERBOSE, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Updating >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> physics >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> on object in hierarchy %s!\n", GetClassname()); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> return; >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> Vector origin; >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> QAngle angles; >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> pPhysics->GetPosition( &origin, &angles >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> if ( !IsFinite( angles.x ) || !IsFinite( >>>>>>>>>>>>>> angles.y ) || >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> !IsFinite( angles.x ) ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> Msg( "Infinite angles from vphysics! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (entity %s)\n", >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> GetDebugName() ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> angles = vec3_angle; >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> #ifndef CLIENT_DLL >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> Vector prevOrigin = GetAbsOrigin(); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> #endif >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> for ( int i = 0; i < 3; ++i ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> angles[ i ] = AngleNormalize( >>>>>>>>>>>>>> angles[ i ] ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> #ifndef CLIENT_DLL >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> NetworkQuantize( origin, angles ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> #endif >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> if ( origin.IsValid() ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> SetAbsOrigin( origin ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> else >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> Msg( "Infinite origin from vphysics! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (entity %s)\n", >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> GetDebugName() ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> SetAbsAngles( angles ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> // Interactive debris converts back to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> debris when it >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> comes >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> to rest >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> if ( pPhysics->IsAsleep() && >>>>>>>>>>>>>> GetCollisionGroup() == >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> COLLISION_GROUP_INTERACTIVE_DEBRIS ) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> { >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> SetCollisionGroup( >>>>>>>>>>>>>> COLLISION_GROUP_DEBRIS ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> #ifndef CLIENT_DLL >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> PhysicsTouchTriggers( &prevOrigin ); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> PhysicsRelinkChildren(gpGlobals->frametime); >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> #endif >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> } >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> break; >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> However I still have stuttering when I set >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "net_fakelag" to anything >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>> 0. And its gets worst the higher the FPS... >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list archives, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list archives, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list archives, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> list archives, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> -Tony >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > -- *Michael Kramer, Software Engineer & SEO Expert* http://www.siosphere.com | kra...@siosphere.com *[c] 801-530-9454* * * * * -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. 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