John, When you think about it, it is highly unlikely that your band is playing all 50 year old Conn horns, plus or minus a few years. School horns have a hard life, and even those that are well cared for don't often make it to 50 years. Conn horns were made in Elkhart IN from 1919-1971. From 1971 to the mid 1980's they were made in a factory in Abilene TX, formerly used to manufacture Reynolds instruments. From the mid 1980's to current, they were made in the consolidated Conn-King factory (now the Conn-Holton factory) in Eastlake OH.
The bells that you describe are not from the Elkhart era; they are from Abilene and Eastlake (1971- current). Elkhart bells always showed Elkhart IND and rarely had horn model information. Any with model information I have seen or heard reported on Elkhart bells was quite old - 1930's. The horns may be much newer than the 1950's, or they may be older bodies that have had their bells replaced. The presence of many differing braces and components is not unusual - if a repairman doesn't have an exact replacement part, s/he may use an available part from another make of horn, especially if it's a large batch of school instruments. The more repair work done, the more likely it is that inconsistent parts may have been used. Another possibility is that one or more horn bodies is actually a different make, like a King 1160/2260 or a Holton, that has had a Conn bell put on it. Regarding serial numbers, the latest information on serial numbers from the Conn Loyalist site states that horns made in Eastlake from 1995 to 2000 have an unknown number scheme, but those made from 2000 on are of the form 5 999999. Horns from that 5 year window may have serial numbers that look like Elkhart era numbers. Other information that has showed up on this group and the Yahoo horn group suggests that in the early days in Abilene, 1971-73, instruments coming out of Abilene may have had serial numbers of older forms, rather than the P99999 and R99999 series that was supposed to be standard. Horns from Abilene and Eastlake from 1974 - 1995 should have serial numbers of the form YMY9999, where YMY is a date code starting with G,H or I, and 9999 was a sequence number. Both King and Holton horns have serial numbers of 6 digits, like the older Elkhart instruments. Richard Hirsh, Chicago ------- John Stacy wrote: This year we have a new brass director at my high school. One of the things he did was go though the inventory and get all instruments in working order. There were some instruments that were almost unknown around the band hall, like they were hidden and recently uncovered. For horns, there was one King Eroica in passable condition, and an unnamed horn that looks very close to an Eroica. There were also two 8Ds, which were both in very fine condition. One, with the exception of this huge dent on the flair under the pinky ring could be passed off as new from more than two feet away. This 8D is rather interesting. The serial number is 559xxx, meaning it was from 1955 if I dated it right. This is about the era of the rest of the 8Ds the school owns. We have 9, The oldest is from 1954, and the newest is from about 1962. They are practically identical, but with slightly varying lead pipes, and on the one I was using, different valve levers. However, this one 1955 Conn really sticks out from the rest. I'll go from the leadpipe out to the bell with all the differences. The lead pipe for one is quite a bit smaller bore wise than the other lead pipes. It gives no more or less resistance, however. The bracing that connects the lead pipe to the flair is also a whole inch and a half longer on each of its 'arms.' It's also thicker and more rounded. On the main tuning slide, there are the last 3 digits of the serial number. This is only on one of the other horns. It is engraved, but it looks like the engraver had Tourrette's or something like that because the numbers are erratically engraved and are even cleaved. The curve right after the main slide that connects it to the Bb valve casing has an extra curve away from the valve casing. It has a very strange S shape. Each of the valve cylinders is quite strange. For one, there is a "B" on each of them. It's under the numbers 1 2 and 3 on each of the valves. Under each of the valve caps, the B is also present. Serial number is on the second valve, this is no different from the others. The witness marks are off. On the first valve, the marks line up when the valve is pressed, but not when it isn't. It's off by about 20 degrees or so. This is about the standard on the other two valves as well. The thumb valve has witness marks going the opposite direction than what I've seen as normal, facing towards the lead pipe. The thumb's marks are the only ones that line up when the valve is pressed and it isn't. The valve levers are strange. For one, they're very light. The metal is very different from the other horns. For another, they're very quiet and fast. The thumb valve uses a string linkage rather than the mechanical linkage I'm used to seeing on 8Ds. The tubing that goes out from the third valve, which eventually turns into the top F horn tuning slide(not the F third valve slide) has a much wider curve than the others. It goes out way farther as well. All bracings are drastically different. Instead of having a U shaped plate, a cylinder between them, and another U shaped plate, they have circular plates. The last thing is the icon engraved on the bell throat. On the other Conn's, It's a shield and banner with ornamental flames and whatnot under it. It says C. G. Conn(r) on top then 8D in the banner, then U.S.A under that. On this one, it says in really big letters, CONN(with no little r after it) then 8D under it in big letters. Under that it's USA. The engraving is in a different lettering style as well. It is also very inconsistent, as some lines are thick then thin, some lines are thin all the way, and some are thick all the way. It's very random and inconsistent. It's also slightly lopsided. My question is, why is this one Conn so drastically different from the others from practically the same era? It's even different from the other 1955 one, which is almost identical to the others. It plays very well, but the fourth line D is occasionally stuffy on the Bb side. It is much more responsive What do the B's mean on the valves? Why are there such inconsistencies and errors that make it seem thrown together? Thanks -John Stacy _______________________________________________ post: [email protected] unsubscribe or set options at https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
