Hey, Jay Ray! You have done caught on re: the ascending horn design!
My Alex 102 is an ascending, compensating horn and the answer is "Yes."
The third valve is ascending on both the F and Bb sides. One of the
ways of describing the horn is that it is a quadruple horn in C, Bb, G,
and F, each of which has 2 valves to manipulate. Then, you never play
1st valve on the C and G horns because it cancels the C and the G. So,
in all cases you never have any 1-2-3 or 1-3 fingerings to worry with.
And sure enough, the F horn solo in Eroica symphony or that pesky
little thing in the Franck D minor with the high Ab and A become mere
child's play. Glory Hallelujah! Very interesting way to build a horn!
Cheers, Mansur's Answers
On Wednesday, May 11, 2005, at 08:53 AM, James Ray Crenshaw wrote:
Some of the advantages of eb horn:
http://www.osmun.com/prod/Schmid/SchmidEb.html
This was fascinating reading. Years ago, due to the boredom of playing
"professionally" in a band that rewarded stagnancy and punished
creativity,
I got to thinking of Dennis Brain's ascending C-valve that he had
installed
on his Alexander single-Bb horn. I imagined what fingerings would be
different, and how he might've used it to his advantage. The Bb horn's
2nd-line G came to mind: "How cool! That pancake-flat G (normally 1st
valve
on Bb horn) would now be an open note (+ the C-valve)." That is, a
1st-line
F forced up a whole step by the ascending key.
Another advantage of having an ascending C-valve on the Bb side would
be a
nice above-the-staff open A, which, on a regular Bb horn is lies
either on
the lower edge of usefulness or "flatter than Dick Tracy's haircut."
Also,
the G below the staff would be open (+ the C-valve) instead of
requiring
1&3. And again, the D above high-C would be an open (+ the C-valve)
note
instead of requiring 1&2 or, alternatively (and flatly), 3.
As far as I can tell, Dennis Brain's ascending C valve was a separate
valve
added to the regular complement of 1-2-3 valveset but (though I reckon
most
here already know this), I've read that the French used to be big on
having
the ascending C-valve as THE THIRD VALVE on an otherwise
regular-looking
double horn. What I don't know is whether the ascending 3rd valve was
on the
Bb SIDE ONLY, or if it also worked on the F-side of the double horn. If
someone knows, how 'bout tag this post with a reply, eh?
Well, boredom being what it is, I couldn't stop with thinking only of
the
ascending C valve, so I began to contemplate the common F/Bb
change-valve on
my common Holton H179 being in several different keys, running the
harmonic
series and fingering charts through my head while playing. When all
was said
and done (or imagined), the ascending C valve and an ascending Eb
valve made
the most sense to me, with a high-F possibility being close, but
somewhat
behind.
I've always liked to think of the change valve on a double as Prof
Pizka
does; that is, a kind of "supercharger." Yes, I know; if you can play
the
note, you can play it... no amount of valves will suddenly transform
you
into a horn player. Well, even though the change valve doesn't
magically
thrust you up a perfect 4th with no chance of missing, it can still be
very
helpful. Thinking of the change-valve as a "supercharger" (or modified
octave key) is nothing more than a psychological game one plays with
one's
self but--you must admit--it's a pretty GOOD game! Read on...
My wife (who has a master's degree in Horn performance) is a fine horn
player, though she's never really liked playing close to high-C all
that
much. Oh, she can DO it alright, but she just doesn't feel secure up
there.
Also, she's one of those
"press-the-Bb-trigger-at-2nd-line-G#-no-matter-what" players. She was
taught
that way, nurtured that way, she developed that way, and that way is
the way
she does it. This method of fingering is the paradigm in which she
thinks
about all things horn-related. This system serves her well but, on
occasion,
she can be shown that there's SOMETIMES a better way. Illustration?
I recently got to fill in on 3rd horn in her orchestra, and on the
program
was Berlioz's nifty "Hungarian March," where the 1st horn skips and
bounces
along on a top-of-the-staff F#, then thrusts up a fourth to a ringing
high
B-natural. She cuffed it once in rehearsal and, at the break, I talked
to
her about Prof Pizka's "supercharger" effect. I told her, "For
security, why
not begin the repeated 'skipping F#' sequence on the Bb horn. Then,
while
keeping the 2nd valve down, change to the F-side by releasing the
trigger
somewhere during 'skipping" sequence. Now you're skipping along on the
F-side, and you have the change valve to help you 'thrust' up to the
high
B-natural." She was willing to try it.
First, I had her play it her way, then I asked her to play it "The
Pizka
Supercharger Way." You should've heard the difference. Played her
regular
way (staying on Bb horn all the way) she got the notes, but the high
B-natural lacked that certain "liveliness" that I knew was normally
part of
her playing. Trepidation is all it was. Then she tried it "The Pizka
Way"
three times in rapid succession. The first was much more alive, and
each
time thereafter it got even better. In short, the passage suddenly came
alive for her. It was merely that psychological "can't miss" feeling
that
one gets when stabbing the Bb trigger, a feeling that is absent if you
simply play the whole phrase on the Bb horn. You see, when you're
ALREADY
pressing the trigger (before you need to), there's nothing left in
reserve;
no "secret weapon" to give you that much-needed boost. Oh, and one
other
thing: Let's not forget the WONDERFUL, "velvet razor blade" sound the
F-horn
carries on certain upper register notes... this top-line F# being one
of my
favorites. It's simply bubbling over with character!
We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming. Had this
been an
actual emergency, you would have been instructed to play pedal tones
on an
F-alto horn.
jrc in SC
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