Dear all,
Thanks for your various answers!
I will use Martin D's order of items:
1) Thanks Russ for the tip, we'll do this + improve the instructions to
make to try to maximize the quality of contributions on this project
2) Is an interesting topic. So far I have read a tutorial on how to
create tasks on the TM, however a more comprehensive documentation on
what to put in instructions to improve the quality of contribution would
certainly be interesting. Then to me the key is the coordination between
the project manager and the validators on the project... This is a
workflow we are intending to work on but haven't really had time for so far.
3) As you said it is not really my concern, I just pushed the issue to
the community to inform & get guidance.
Personally I'm not in favor of blocking users (or really as a
last-resort solution), there are many mediation ways to explore before.
If a HOT organiser wants to get in touch with this contributor that
would be great, since he hasn't been receptive to our (polite)
explanations, just to make sure that it will not happen again.
(and my message to the "OSM community" was a lapsus, I meant "HOT
community", since this is rather an HOT issue than general OSM issue in
my opinion - not a "conflict" for the Data WG since the debate was not
really on the OSM data but the use of the TM)
Thanks again to all & best regards
Martin
On 11/03/2016 02:36, Mikel Maron wrote:
Worth looking at how the OSM Foundation Data Working Group manages
vandalism and disputes for ideas on how to govern rare disruptive
behavior like this
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Vandalism#Governance.
-Mikel
* Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron
On Thursday, March 10, 2016 12:02 PM, Nicholas Doiron
<ni...@codeforamerica.org> wrote:
> can project owners currently block certain users from using the
Tasking Manager? Would it make sense to do so?
This feature will be necessary at some point if not already. We
all believe in good intentions, and the success of Task Manager
means that good intentions is a good starting point. But looking
forward, it's better to have the feature ready than to find
someone sabotaging Task Manager during a natural disaster or a
pilot by a new partner org.
This feature doesn't block users from editing OSM or reverting
changesets, so I think it's ethical within the OSM world.
-- Nick Doiron
On Mar 10, 2016 8:37 AM, "Martin Dittus" <mar...@dekstop.de
<mailto:mar...@dekstop.de>> wrote:
It seems to me there are really three separate concerns here.
1. Resuming Martin’s project. Russ addresses this.
2. OSM data quality discussions around HOT newcomers. That’s a
big topic and an ongoing discussion, and is maybe best
discussed in the places Russ mentions. Any such incident is
probably best be referred to such a forum, however HOT members
should be active participants in such discussions, so Martin
please share links if you post to one of the OSM lists.
It may also be a good time to review data quality concerns
that have been raised, and find some kind of consensus
approach to dealing with them. For example a “best practices”
doc for HOT coordinators (which may already exist). This will
then help have such a discussion.
3. Dealing with uncooperative contributors. Without knowing
the details, it seems to me that this individual has decided
to take matters in their own hand and disrupt an existing
process. While their intentions may come from a good place,
their acts are hardly constructive. I'm concerned that this
issue might not simply go away. Furthermore, it may also spill
over into other projects.
As a community member I think this action was transgressive to
a point where it warrants a slightly more formal response; for
example a polite email by a HOT organiser with an invitation
for dialogue, and a request to stop. I also don’t think Martin
should be tasked to deal with the issue by himself; it seems
he hardly caused the conflict, he merely happened to
coordinate the project, which is one among many.
An idle thought — can project owners currently block certain
users from using the Tasking Manager? Would it make sense to
do so? Such a block would be easily bypassed, and might stoke
the flames rather than stop the issue.
(Martin, you’re welcome to contact me off-list if you want
support for any of this, however I should also say I’m not
formally a HOT member.)
m.
> On 10 Mar 2016, at 15:20, Russell Deffner
<russell.deff...@hotosm.org
<mailto:russell.deff...@hotosm.org>> wrote:
>
> P.S. Martin,
>
> The Activation WG does not handle 'edit conflicts' or really
any conflicts as we have plenty of those internally for
coordinating HOT stuff. You also started with 'Dear OSM
community' - just to clarify - this list is the 'HOT
community'; to address the larger/general OSM community you
would want to email t...@openstreetmap.org
<mailto:t...@openstreetmap.org> - and if you do need
'intervention' with another mapper, that's the OSMF Data WG
(http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Data_working_group)
>
> Happy Mapping! (let me know if you need help
'resetting'/invalidating all tiles in 1649)
> =Russ
>
> Russell Deffner
> russell.deff...@hotosm.org <mailto:russell.deff...@hotosm.org>
> Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
> http://hotosm.org <http://hotosm.org/>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Russell Deffner [mailto:russell.deff...@hotosm.org
<mailto:russell.deff...@hotosm.org>]
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 8:04 AM
> To: 'Martin Noblecourt'; 'hot@openstreetmap.org
<mailto:hot@openstreetmap.org>'
> Subject: RE: [HOT] Issue with Harare project - 1649
>
> Hi, Just a quick note - you can now 'invalidate all tiles'
from the misc tab as a Project Manager; so no need to re-create.
>
> Also this user http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/rab -
although they have a long OSM history, I wouldn't call them
'expert' as they still don't use changeset comments correctly
after 8 years :)
>
> =Russ
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Martin Noblecourt [mailto:m_nobleco...@cartong.org
<mailto:m_nobleco...@cartong.org>]
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 7:51 AM
> To: hot@openstreetmap.org <mailto:hot@openstreetmap.org>
> Subject: [HOT] Issue with Harare project - 1649
>
> Dear OSM community,
>
> I'd like to get your feedback about what happened on the
following
> project: http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/1649
>
> This project have been marked as completely done by one
single mapper
> without tracing, under the argument new mappers would damage
existing
> data. The area is indeed already well mapped but also a lot
of data is
> still missing (including rivers, roads and buildings) and it
is pretty
> easy to trace so I doubt the project will damage the area
(unless
> contribution to OSM is now reserved to "experts").
> Another argument we received was that some of our previous
Missing maps
> projects (such as 1465/1466) were a "complete quality
disaster"...
> Although still unfinished and requiring an important work of
validation
> (like all TM projects...), we strongly disagree that these
projects were
> a disaster: they allowed mapping large areas that weren't mapped
> previously at all - which is in fact the goal of Missing Maps...
> The road network in particular still requires work of
> standardization/clean up, but this is quite common on TM
activities too
> (getting mappers, whether they are new ones or experienced
but not used
> to the African context, to properly tag roads, is a long-term
> challenge). Starting from scratch mapping of an area is as
everyone know
> a work that often requires several steps.
>
> We intend to recreate the same project on the TM as it will
be a waste
> of time to invalidate all the tiles again, please let us
know if you
> don't think it is the appropriate way.
> Feedback are of course most welcome on the tasks created by
Missing
> maps, we have in fact already had very interesting
conversation with
> great validators and will be happy to hear from more people
as long as
> it is respectful of everyone :-)
> (I someone thinks this message should to be forwarded to the
Activation
> working group too, please do so since I'm not on it)
>
> Thanks for your feedback,
>
> Martin & Violaine for the CartONG team
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> HOT mailing list
> HOT@openstreetmap.org <mailto:HOT@openstreetmap.org>
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> HOT@openstreetmap.org <mailto:HOT@openstreetmap.org>
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/hot
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