>>>>> "Jefsey" == Jefsey Morfin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
I think the following is a good summary of our quandary. Jefsey> At 11:17 20/09/2006, Dave Cridland wrote: >> Well, I think there's a lot of confusion between the statement "We, >> as engineers trying to maintain our scientific integrity as a whole, >> consider this specification a good thing and recommend it", and "We, >> as disinterested engineers trying to be practical and document what >> gets used, note this specification is widely used". Jefsey> The first statement best matches RFC 3935, except that "we" should be Jefsey> read as the IETF "leaders" (what is realistic in a rough consensus Jefsey> approach). The problem ("the near-impossibility of getting an Jefsey> informed consensus opinion on a complex subject out of a community of Jefsey> several thousand people in a short time") and this soliution is Jefsey> documented in part 3. Jefsey> Also, "The Internet isn't value-neutral, and neither is the IETF. We Jefsey> want the Internet to be useful for communities that share our Jefsey> commitment to openness and fairness. We embrace technical concepts Jefsey> such as decentralized control, edge-user empowerment and sharing Jefsey> of resources, because those concepts resonate with the core values Jefsey> of the IETF community. These concepts have little to do with Jefsey> the technology that's possible, and much to do with the technology Jefsey> that we choose to create." However,"we are also constrained by the Jefsey> principle of competence: Where we do not have, and cannot gather, the Jefsey> competence needed to make technically sound standards, we should not Jefsey> attempt to take the leadership." because "Sometimes the IETF Jefsey> leverages standards that are defined and maintained by other Jefsey> organizations; we continue to work with those organizations on their Jefsey> standards and do not attempt to take them over." Jefsey> This creates many difficulties in world reality which is under Jefsey> distributed control, and therefore edge-user centric, working by Jefsey> subsidiarity, using concerted procedures and consensus, while we may Jefsey> chose to select parts of external standards and contradict their Jefsey> inner logic because they are not based on the same core values, or do Jefsey> not share our vision of these values. Jefsey> The second statement seems therefore more appropriate. However this Jefsey> is only a reporting mission and we miss the IEB (Internet Engineer's Jefsey> Book) publication adequate system. We should therefore target some Jefsey> intermediate statement between "influence" and "report" and consider Jefsey> the RFC 3935 principles of responsiblity and competence, and the most Jefsey> inportant sentence "the benefit of a standard to the Internet is in Jefsey> interoperability - that multiple products implementing a standard are Jefsey> able to work together in order to deliver valuable functions to the Jefsey> Internet's users" remembering the quote above "Sometimes the IETF Jefsey> leverages standards that are defined and maintained by other Jefsey> organizations; we continue to work with those organizations on their Jefsey> standards and do not attempt to take them over". Interoperability Jefsey> must not be only within our own standards, but with the standards we Jefsey> leverage" we have the duty to respect and to know. Jefsey> jfc Jefsey> _______________________________________________ Jefsey> Ietf mailing list Jefsey> Ietf@ietf.org Jefsey> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf _______________________________________________ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf