Thanks, Pankaj ji and Chadwell ji On 15 Jan 2017 1:44 a.m., "C CHADWELL" <chrischadwell...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> Dear Pankaj > > Thanks for information and most likely orchid. I realised that I did not > take close-ups > of the young fruits/dried-up flowers, making your task more difficult. No > doubt if you had been > there you would have examined the specimen more closely with a hand-lens, > revealing important > characteristics. > > As you and I (but not everyone) realise, traditional identification and > full DETERMINATIONS > have been based upon examination either with the naked eye or using a > hand-lens > @ x10 or x20 magnification or IF required at higher magnification using a > binocular microscope > of dried, pressed specimens. > > General photos do not always reveal the necessary details to be certain of > an identification. > > *Perhaps, you could offer some TIPS (advice) to beginners with Orchidaceae > (which includes* > *me) as to what parts of orchids SHOULD be photographed close-up and in > focus? Along with* > *any notes to be taken "in the field" to help with subsequent > identification efforts.* > > *I think everyone realises that unless one is part of an officially > sanctioned survey team/expedition* > *it is against the rules to "dig up" orchids - even if characteristics of > the tubers might be diagnostic.* > > *May I repeat my previous WARNING that care should be taken when > photographing terrestrial orchids, as it is* > *all too easy to unintentionally damage smaller, non-flowering specimens > of the same species close* > *to the flowering examples which might have caught your eye. Trampling > can cause greater harm than* > *realised.* > > As to the previous records for Gymnadenia orchidis Lindl. in Kashmir. > Stewart recorded it @ 3300-3900m > from above Sonamarg and the Lidder Valley (beyond Pahlgam). > > I would estimate the altitude where the orchid had been dig up to be 3000m > or even less, so well below any > of Stewart's records but not excessively so, given how infrequently most > orchids are found/recorded. > > 'Plants of Gulmarg' (Naqshi, Singh & Koul in 1984) did not list this > species making it a second New record for the 'Gulmarg' > area, along with Herminium monorchis - unless others have recorded them in > the intervening period. The fact that I came > across both during a single, brief visit on my last time in Kashmir does > illustrate how poorly known Orchidaceae is in much > of the Himalaya - though this applies to many families and genera. > > This situation is complicated by the fluctuation in population size of > colonies of any given orchid species from year-to-year - > something which happens in the UK and, presumably, also in the Himalaya. > > Enumeration of the Flowering Plants of Nepal records G.orchidis from > Kashmir to Bhutan & SE Tibet @ 3000-4700m. > The latter elevation being quite high for an orchid - even beating > Herminium monorchis and several others which are > known to 4600m. I shouldn't think there are many Himalayan orchids known > from 5000m+ > > The non-taxonomists amongst this group may be interested to know that this > plant has previously been known as > Habernaria orchidis, Orchis habernarioides and under other species of > Gymnadenia! And no doubt be mumbling about > "Why can't these 'botanists' make their minds up....!" > > *I plan to post the few images I have of what I understand to be > Dactylorhiza hatagirea (and related species) plus* > *information for your comments.* > > Best Wishes, > > > Chris Chadwell > > > 81 Parlaunt Road > SLOUGH > SL3 8BE > UK > > www.shpa.org.uk > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Pankaj Kumar <sahanipan...@gmail.com> > *To:* J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> > *Cc:* efloraofindia <indiantreepix@googlegroups.com>; C CHADWELL < > chrischadwell...@btinternet.com> > *Sent:* Saturday, 14 January 2017, 15:19 > *Subject:* Re: Orchid used for medicine in Kashmir. Identification sought. > > Both Dactylorhiza and Gymnadenia have digitate tubers.The flowers are dry > so I cant make out clearly, but I think this is Gymnadenia orchidis. > Labellum is short in length with three distinct lobes as in fifth pic I can > see. > Thanks and regards > Pankaj > > > On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 12:40 PM, J.M. Garg <jmga...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Thanks, Chadwell ji > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "C CHADWELL" <chrischadwell261@btinternet. com > <chrischadwell...@btinternet.com>> > Date: 13 Jan 2017 1:57 a.m. > Subject: Orchid used for medicine in Kashmir. Identification sought. > To: "J.M. Garg" <jmga...@gmail.com> > Cc: > > I am sharing some images I took of an orchid which had been dug up by > a local Kashmiri > between Khelanmarg and Gulmarg in Kashmir for use as a medicine. > > Since this group is blessed with some Orchidaceae specialists, it makes > sense for me to > seek their thoughts as to its identity, rather than speculating > myself. As I have explained > before, I view Orchidaceae as merely another plant family. Unless one > makes a special > effort, it is not possible to reliably identify many genera and/or species. > > Furthermore, the specimen is at the fruiting stage which makes it much > harder than when in flower. > > I was reminded, when I came across the orchid being dug up during my last > visit to Kashmir > a few years ago about what is known in Tibetan Medicine as "Dhang lags" - > this transliteration > is translated as "hand-shaped-root". > > In Ladakh the local amchis collect what I understand to be Dactylorhiza > hatagirea under this Tibetan > name. > > The roots are often of considerable importance identification-wise for > doctors of Traditional Tibetan Medicine - far more > so than in Western plant identification/classification - as are taste and > smell. > > I shall submit an additional post about D.hatagirea and related species. > > Images 1-8 taken between Khelanmarg & Gulmarg, Kashmir. > > > Best Wishes, > > > Chris Chadwell > > > 81 Parlaunt Road > SLOUGH > SL3 8BE > UK > > www.shpa.org.uk > > > > > > > > -- > ************************************************************ > ********************************************************** > *Pankaj Kumar*, Ph.D. > *IUCN-SSC Orchid Specialist Group Asia* > > *Office*: > > Conservation Officer > > Orchid Conservation Section > > Flora Conservation Department > > Kadoorie Farm and Botanic Garden (KFBG) Corporation > Lam Kam Road, Tai Po, New Territories, Hong Kong. > > *Residence*: > House no. 39, 2nd Floor, Shui Wo Tsuen > Lam Tsuen, Tai Po, New Territories, Hong Kong. > *email*: pku...@kfbg.org; sahanipan...@gmail.com > *Phone*: +852 2483 7128 (office - 8:30am to 5:00pm); +852 9436 6251 > (mobile); *Fax*: +852 2483 7194 > > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. 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