Jagrī in context, may I say, I e. Kashmir or thereabouts in about 10th c. On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 21:16, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY <[[email protected]](mailto:On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 21:16, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY <<a href=)> wrote:
> Yes, Alexander. There is not much of an issue with how old the word yak.rt > is. The discussion is more about the likely sources of jagri. > > Madhav > > Madhav M. Deshpande > Professor Emeritus, Sanskrit and Linguistics > University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA > Senior Fellow, Oxford Center for Hindu Studies > Adjunct Professor, National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore, India > > [Residence: Campbell, California, USA] > > On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 12:06 PM Uskokov, Aleksandar < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Curiously skipping arguably the most famous reference of them all, in the >> very opening of the Bṛhad-āraṇyaka, which raises the question of what is >> often sheer randomness of how ai engines operate. >> >> Best wishes, >> Aleksandar >> >> Aleksandar Uskokov >> >> Senior Lector and Associate Research Scholar >> >> South Asian Studies Council & Department of Religious Studies, Yale >> University >> >> 203-432-1972 | [email protected] >> >> "The Philosophy of the Brahma-sutra: An Introduction" >> >> https://www.amzn.com/1350150002/ >> >> Office Hours Sign-up: https://calendly.com/aleksandar-uskokov >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> From: INDOLOGY <[email protected]> on behalf of Madhav >> Deshpande via INDOLOGY <[email protected]> >> Sent: Friday, August 8, 2025 2:58 PM >> To: Rolf Heinrich Koch <[email protected]>; Indology >> <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Claude >> >> For whatever it's worth, the DeepSeek AI provided the following textual >> references: >> >> 1. Sanskrit (यकृत् / Yakṛt) – Ayurvedic Texts >> >> The liver is extensively discussed in classical Ayurveda as part of the >> "Raktavaha Srotas" (blood-carrying channels). >> >> Key References: >> >> - >> >> Charaka Samhita (चरकसंहिता, ~300 BCE–200 CE) >> >> - >> >> *Chikitsāsthāna 15/16* – Discusses liver disorders (yakṛd-dalyudara, >> enlarged liver). >> >> - >> >> Sūtrasthāna 28 – Lists yakṛt among major organs. >> >> - >> >> Sushruta Samhita (सुश्रुतसंहिता, ~4th century CE) >> >> - >> >> Sharīrasthāna 4 – Describes the liver’s anatomical position. >> >> - >> >> Nidānasthāna 7 – Diagnoses liver diseases (yakṛt-plīhodara). >> >> - >> >> Ashtanga Hridaya (अष्टाङ्गहृदय, 6th century CE) >> >> - >> >> Sūtrasthāna 12 – Mentions yakṛt in the context of digestion. >> >> Example Verse (Charaka): >> >>> "यकृत्प्लीहानमुदरं गुल्मः..." >>> ("Disorders of the liver, spleen, and abdomen...") >>> — Charaka Samhita, Chikitsāsthāna 15 >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> 2. Pali (यकन / Yakana) – Buddhist Texts >> >> The Pali Canon refers to the liver in medical and metaphorical contexts. >> >> Key References: >> >> - >> >> Vinaya Piṭaka (विनयपिटक, Mahāvagga VI.14.6) >> >> - >> >> Prohibits monks from consuming animal livers (as part of strict dietary >> rules). >> >> - >> >> Milindapañha (मिलिन्दपञ्ह, ~1st century BCE) >> >> - >> >> Compares the liver to a "storehouse of blood" in anatomical discussions. >> >> - >> >> Pali Jātaka Tales (e.g., Jātaka 319) >> >> - >> >> Metaphorically uses "yakana" in descriptions of bodily suffering. >> >> Example Passage: >> >>> "Yakanaṃ hadayaṃ kilomakaṃ antogataṃ..." >>> ("The liver, heart, and kidneys are inside...") >>> — Vinaya Piṭaka commentary >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> 3. Jain Prakrit (जिगर / Jigara) – Ardhamāgadhī & Śaurasenī >> >> Jain texts in Prakrit use "jigara" (from Sanskrit yakṛt). >> >> Key References: >> >> - >> >> Uttarādhyayana Sūtra (उत्तराध्ययन सूत्र, 5th–3rd century BCE) >> >> - >> >> Verse 36.75: Lists jigara among organs affected by karma. >> >> - >> >> Sūtrakṛtāṅga (सूत्रकृताङ्ग 1.6.27) >> >> - >> >> Forbids harming creatures "from liver to bones" (jigara-aṭṭhi). >> >> - >> >> Paiyalacchi (पैयलच्छी, 10th-century Prakrit lexicon) >> >> - >> >> Defines: "Jigara = Yakṛt" (यकृत्). >> >> Example Verse (Sūtrakṛtāṅga): >> >>> "जिगर-अट्ठी-मज्जाणं..." >>> ("From liver to bones and marrow...") >>> — Sūtrakṛtāṅga 1.6.27 >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> 4. Apabhraṃśa (जिगरु / Jigaru) – Medieval Jain & Medical Texts >> >> The transitional form "jigaru" appears in late Prakrit/Apabhraṃśa. >> >> Key References: >> >> - >> >> Bhavisayatta Kaha (भविसयत्त कहा, 8th–10th century CE) >> >> - >> >> A Jain story describing a king’s "jigaru-roga" (liver disease). >> >> - >> >> Ravidatta’s Medical Works (रविदत्त, ~9th century CE) >> >> - >> >> Uses jigaru in prescriptions for liver ailments. >> >> Example Line: >> >>> "जिगरु दुक्खु" ("Liver pain") >>> — Bhavisayatta Kaha >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Evolution Summary: >> >> - >> >> Vedic Sanskrit: Yakṛt (यकृत्) >> >> - >> >> Pali: Yakana (यकन) >> >> - >> >> Early Prakrit: Yakai (यकइ) >> >> - >> >> Later Prakrit (Jain): Jigara (जिगर) >> >> - >> >> Apabhraṃśa: Jigaru (जिगरु) >> >> - >> >> Modern Hindi/Urdu: Jigar (जिगर) >> >> These references contain the use of jigara or jigaru from ancient Jain >> Prakrit texts and Apabhraṃśa texts. The Deśīnāmamāla also lists it. Assuming >> these textual references are accurate, the word jigar/jigaru goes back to >> Prakrit/Apabhraṃśa ancestry. I wonder if we would still consider it a >> borrowing from Persian. >> >> Madhav M. Deshpandee >> Professor Emeritus, Sanskrit and Linguistics >> University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA >> Senior Fellow, Oxford Center for Hindu Studies >> Adjunct Professor, National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore, India >> >> [Residence: Campbell, California, USA] >> >> On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 11:46 AM Madhav Deshpande < [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Dear Rolf, >>> >>> I am not an expert in all these languages. But from the information >>> provided by Open.AI and Claude.AI, it seems to me that the Persian jigar is >>> cognate with Sanskrit yakr̥t. The reason I am reluctant to think jagrī >>> coming from Persian jigar, is that such a borrowing does not explain the ī >>> at the end of jagrī, and then we have to assume that somehow the i of >>> jigar changed to a of jagrī. That requires too many ad hoc changes. On the >>> other hand, in numerous modern IA languages, the y of Sanskrit is replaced >>> with j, and the r̥ is routinely pronounced as rī in North India. The loss >>> of final Sanskrit consonants is a common feature of all Prakrit languages. >>> Given these considerations, I see more of a clear line of connection >>> between Sanskrit yakr̥t and your jagrī, than to the Persian word. This is >>> my thinking. >>> >>> Madhav >>> Madhav M. Deshpande >>> Professor Emeritus, Sanskrit and Linguistics >>> University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA >>> Senior Fellow, Oxford Center for Hindu Studies >>> Adjunct Professor, National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore, India >>> >>> [Residence: Campbell, California, USA] >>> >>> On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 9:57 AM Rolf Heinrich Koch < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Madhav, >>>> >>>> just learning the Open.ai system, I asked Open.ai exactly the same as you >>>> did with Claude.ai. >>>> >>>> This is the answer (which I cannot fully understand): >>>> >>>> The Persian word jigar (جگر), meaning “liver”, has a well-established >>>> history within the Indo-Iranian branch of the Indo-European language >>>> family. Here’s the full etymological breakdown: >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> 🔹 1. Persian jigar (جگر) – meaning: liver >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> In Classical Persian, jigar refers both to: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> The anatomical liver, and >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Metaphorical qualities like courage, passion, and deep emotion — much >>>> like how “heart” is used in English. >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> 🔹 2. Etymology: from Middle and Old Iranian >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Middle Persian: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> The word appears as jigar (same as modern) or jekar. >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Old Persian: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> The word is not directly attested, but is reconstructed based on related >>>> Avestan and Indo-Iranian forms. >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> 🔹 3. Reconstructed Indo-Iranian and Proto-Indo-European (PIE) roots >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Avestan (East Iranian): >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> yakarə (liver) – a clear cognate. >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Proto-Iranian: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Reconstructed as jigar or jakar, derived from an earlier Indo-Iranian form. >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Proto-Indo-Iranian: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Reconstructed as yákṛt (same as Sanskrit yakṛt = liver) >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Proto-Indo-European (PIE) root: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> *iék̂wṛ̥ → This is the PIE word for “liver”, and it gives rise to many >>>> cognates across Indo-European languages. >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> 🔹 4. Cognates in other Indo-European languages >>>> >>>> Language Word for "liver" Notes >>>> Sanskrit yakṛt (यकृत्) Exact Indo-Aryan match >>>> Avestan yakarə East Iranian cognate >>>> Latin iecur PIE root preserved (with changes) >>>> Ancient Greek hēpar (ἧπαρ) Different root, not cognate (likely >>>> non-IE origin) >>>> Old English lifere → liver Possibly unrelated, or influenced by >>>> metaphorical use ("life-organ") >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> 🔹 5. Semantic development in Persian >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> In Persian and later Urdu and Hindi, jigar became highly metaphorical: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> jigar-dil = “liver-hearted” → brave >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> jigar-pāra (lit. “a piece of liver”) = a beloved person >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> jigar khun hona (“liver bleeding”) = intense grief >>>> >>>> This is cultural — just as the heart became the seat of emotion in >>>> European traditions, the liver was seen in Persianate culture as the seat >>>> of strong emotions, especially courage and deep love. >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> ✅ Summary: >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> Jigar (جگر) is an authentic Iranian word, descending from >>>> Proto-Indo-European *iék̂wṛ̥ via Indo-Iranian *yakṛt. >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> It is cognate with Sanskrit yakṛt, Latin iecur, and Avestan yakarə. >>>> >>>> - >>>> >>>> The metaphorical richness of the word in Persianate cultures (courage, >>>> love, pain) is a later cultural development, not etymological. >>>> >>>> Would you like a linguistic family tree of this word across Indo-European >>>> languages? >>>> >>>> Am 08.08.2025 um 16:59 schrieb Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY: >>>> >>>>> https://claude.ai/share/2fe502db-185f-447d-b742-88e87ff1c17c >>>>> >>>>> Some interesting connections of the Persian word jigar to Sanskrit word >>>>> taker for liver. >>>>> >>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> >>>>> https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Dr. R. H. Koch - Germany/Sri Lanka >>>> [www.rolfheinrichkoch.wordpress.com](http://www.rolfheinrichkoch.wordpress.com/)
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