On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Lazare Inepologlou <linep...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Hello, > > please read my comment inline... > > 2013/2/28 Sebastian Krebs <krebs....@gmail.com> > > > 2013/2/28 Jens Riisom Schultz <ibmu...@me.com> > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > (I got "hooked off" this discussion, so I have tried to keep up by > > reading > > > the digest... This makes it impossible for me to correctly interleave > my > > > comments, so I'll just "top post" or whatever the term is) (I'm sure > this > > > has been mentioned before but a forum would be so much more accesible > > than > > > this mailing list concept...) > > > > > > > > > * In response to the argument that you want to be able to modify a > > > framework or use it in an unintended manner: > > > This would be possible by explicitly stating "namespace Framework;" in > a > > > given php file. > > > > > > * In response to the argument that php has no assembly concept: > > > I know this, but namespaces are as close as we get, and would > effectively > > > solve this. > > > > > > > No. A namespace is in fact more or less just a prefix, that groups the > > containing elements together. Beside the semantic meaning of grouping > they > > don't have any further abilities, or meaning. > > Without knowing exact details I guess, that "internal" in C# is primary a > > technical thing, that allows a compiler further optimizations, because he > > definitely knows, that the function/method is only used within the > assembly > > and is not required to do anything to expose it to the outside? > > > > > Regardless of the technical details, it is still a fine way of applying > encaptulation so you can't say that it is only a technical thing. > > > > > > > > > > * In response to the argument that php already has accessibility > > > restrictions with private and protected: > > > This is true, but it does not solve all problems. Often you need > classes > > > to interoperate in a way that can only be facilitated by making > > > functionality public. Also, there is no way to make a private or > > protected > > > class (since php has no assembly concept), though what I propose would > > > likely birth the concept of private and protected classes as well. > > > > > > > Maybe it's just me, but no: I've never had the need of what you describe > > and where a public method wasn't apropriate anway... At least for a very > > long time :D > > > > > > > > > > * In response to the argument that PHP does not restrict anyone from > > > adding to a namespace: > > > That is true, but say you were using Doctrine2. Would you ever make a > php > > > file with "namespace Doctrine2;" in it, unless you wanted to modify > > > Doctrine2, and hence you knew what you were doing, or accepted the > risks? > > > > > > > Well, yes. But extending/overriding a components method _always_ > requires, > > that you know what you do, so why enforcing/encouraging hacks, instead of > > the good old "protected"? > > > > > "Protected" is used for extending classes. There is no mechanism to inherit > and extend a namespace so "protected" is irrelevant here. > > > > > > > > > > * In response to the concept of solving this through documentation: > > > First off, this is not possible with the current phpdoc and phpdoc2 > > > standards. Second off, problems like these should not be solved by > > > documentation, imho, or of course I would not propose this. The C# > > > designers seem to agree with me. And the Java designers, too (though > they > > > have no internal keyword they do have a way of hiding framework > specific > > > classes). > > > > > > > > Actually Java has a concept that is identical to your proposal. The default > access modifier (when no access modifier is written) is the "package" > modifier (=accessible from within the same package). > > Ha, it's been years since I'm asking for such a feature to come to PHP. I would love to see a package visibility in PHP, restricting access to 'package'ed members (methods or attributes) to an object born from a class of the same namespace. Would really help some cases in frameworks or so :-) Just my2cents Julien
