Hi,
marc wrote:
>(the layout of j2ee stacks). Sandeep thinks it sucks... could
Well, "sucks" is perhaps a strong word. Hmm..
Let me put it in the right perspective. I spend a lot of time behind the
scenes trying to convince people to use JBoss. Specially senior mgmt in my
company. Why? Well, for one, I want to work with it. And if I don't convince
people its good, then they can tell me not to work with it. Simple.
>From what you've been saying marc, you're trying to portray two perspectives
about how the JBoss suite fits into the scenario of enterprise application
development and deployment - dev and biz.
Developers who are potential users of JBoss are likely to know something
about J2EE. You don't necessarily have to sell J2EE to them. Its downright
sexy. They'll use it anyway. What they would like is, I guess, solid facts
about why they should use JBoss. So give 'em facts. Give 'em numbers.
Benchmarks. Performance stats. Like the number of ms it takes for RMI calls,
calls to the servlet engines, time for hot deploy, how long JBoss runs at a
stretch without working up a sweat. Something about the cool features. Hot
deploy. SOAP support. etc. Something about the cool architecture. The
componentized container. The flexibility of plugging in different
distribution protocols. etc. And make that kind of information very visible.
And as for business men. Well I haven't seen your perspective on that yet,
marc. But one thing they're looking for is good ROI. But Jboss is free! So
where's the catch on ROI? That's when the biz-y folks take a look at things
like the techological risk involved. Like turn-around times for bug-fixes.
Time to market for new features. How close is the implementation to the
latest specs? They also like anything that cuts development and deployment
time (and therefore costs). Good documentation. Good programming frameworks
-don't make their developers start from scratch. Make EJB programming look
as easy as making toast. Also vendor reliability. Are jboss and jboss.org
going to go down the drain a year from now and wash them poor project
directors all out? (This is not very relevant in the open standards J2EE
world where you don't need to worry about vendors lockins, but humor the biz
men, they flushed their brains down their toilets long ago). Ooze
reliability. Ooze stability. Ooze "the fact that JBoss is here and its here
to stay".
The notion of a complete J2EE stack is very important to *both* sides of the
picture. Nobody (except us hackers!) wants to start J2EE dev without having
all the tools neatly filed away under /bin or d:\Program Files <cheap
cliched slogan>JBoss! - All your Java and J2EE needs under one roof! </cheap
cliched slogan>. That kind of stuff. Everybody likes freebies as well. Get
JBoss and you get a host of other things (like sypderMQ, minerva, nirvana
etc thrown in for free).
That kind of sales pitch.
If you see what I'm driving at.
Sandeep.
ps: ignore the ramble if it doesn't make sense to you. i've had six cups of
coffee in the past three hours. caffeine does things to your brain.
"The opinions expressed are mine. Mine alone! Nobody else is responsible
for them or even endorses them--except my cat Dexter, and he signed the
power of attorney only under my threat to cut off his Cat Chow!"
- Mostly Anonymous (circa
1997 A.D)
>-----Original Message-----
>From: jBoss Developer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2000 10:40 AM
>To: jBoss Developer; jBoss
>Subject: FW: [jBoss-Dev] new website
>
>
>Hey guys,
>
>I can take criticism when I see it... I did the "graphics"
>with the "bunny"
>(the layout of j2ee stacks). Sandeep thinks it sucks... could
>be I am not
>an expert on the subject...
>
>does anyone want to take a stab at redoing it?
>
>|-----Original Message-----
>|From: Sandeep Dath [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>|Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2000 9:00 PM
>|To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>|Subject: RE: [jBoss-Dev] new website
>|
>|
>|marc, if I may be so bold as to ask - who made that graphic
>on the first
>|page? Not only did it confuse me to the point that i can no
>longer spell
>|josbss correctly, it also takes us 46kb of valuable
>bandwidth. Works out to
>|approx. 50% of the total page size.
>|
>|Liked the bunny though. ;-) But otherwise...
>|
>|Sandeep.
>|
>|"The opinions expressed are mine. Mine alone! Nobody else is
>responsible
>|for them or even endorses them--except my cat Dexter, and he
>signed the
>|power of attorney only under my threat to cut off his Cat Chow!"
>| - Mostly
>Anonymous (circa
>|1997 A.D)
>|
>|
>|
>|>-----Original Message-----
>|>From: jBoss Developer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>|>Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2000 10:03 AM
>|>To: jBoss Developer
>|>Subject: RE: [jBoss-Dev] new website
>|>
>|>
>|>|I will try the left of the header idea though
>|>
>|>nah....
>|>
>|>marc
>|>
>|>|amrc
>|>|
>|>|
>|>||-----Original Message-----
>|>||From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>|>||[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of marc fleury
>|>||Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2000 6:47 PM
>|>||To: jBoss Developer
>|>||Subject: RE: [jBoss-Dev] new website
>|>||
>|>||
>|>||Well you know we are going to go with advertisement soon (yup, we
>|>||gotta make
>|>||a living somehow :) so the extra room is for that...
>|>||
>|>||marc
>|>||
>|>|||-----Original Message-----
>|>|||From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>|>|||[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Aaron Mulder
>|>|||Sent: Saturday, November 11, 2000 6:01 PM
>|>|||To: jBoss Developer
>|>|||Subject: Re: [jBoss-Dev] new website
>|>|||
>|>|||
>|>||| Overall, quite an improvement. Well done!
>|>|||
>|>||| One "constructive" comment: Unless I make my browser
>|>quite large,
>|>|||the bottom-left navigation links (news, etc.) are dropped
>|>off the bottom
>|>|||of the screen. Could we either put the navigation to the
>|>left of the
>|>|||header too, or just make the header shorter? It is a great
>|>graphic, but
>|>|||it takes like 1/3 of the usable page area...
>|>|||
>|>|||Aaron
>|>|||
>|>|||On Sat, 11 Nov 2000, marc fleury wrote:
>|>|||> online
>|>|||>
>|>|||> only the developers look for now. I will put the biz look and
>|>|||content over
>|>|||> the next few days.
>|>|||>
>|>|||> it is probably FULL OF BUGS please let me know of broken links
>|>||and stuff.
>|>|||> For those with RW passwd on the CVS tree the module is
>|>|||>
>|>|||> newsite
>|>|||>
>|>|||> thanks, enjoy
>|>|||>
>|>|||> marc
>|>|||>
>|>|||>
>|>|||> ________________
>|>|||> Marc Fleury, PhD
>|>|||> CTO, Telkel Inc.
>|>|||> ________________
>|>|||>
>|>|||>
>|>|||
>|>|||
>|>|||
>|>||
>|>||
>|>||
>|>|
>|>|
>|>
>|>
>|>
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