Well the first one is like half of the very very first version of Seam. We 
started using the term "conversation" a few years ago, so it's a copy of that 
concept with a planned minimalist implementation. I don't think this has a good 
chance of success, this is like the "let's simply map a resultset to objects" 
approach to object/relational mapping. You need more immediately.

The second one is the same as the Seam application framework, from a high-level 
perspective.





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