I have not the energy to get involved in this -
but gees, after 58,000 American dead and maybe 3,000,000 Vietnamese dead in a
war fought with American troops, armaments, weapons, military aid, etc. etc.
etc.,
now you tell me it was not OUR war!
Kakki wrote:
> Sorry - I meant to say Vietnam was NOT our war.
>
> > I can't see where you think that. Vietnam was >protested largely in part
> because it was our war.
Here is my favorite quote from the speech last night:
"Women are not allowed to attend school. You can be jailed for owning a
television. Religion can be practiced only as their leaders dictate. A man
can be jailed in Afghanistan if his beard is not long enough."
If that's all true, W, might as well drop the bomb on them!
And as I depart, I am wondering why we demand the Taliban to turn over bin
laden without, I repeat, without our providing proof of his guilt. The
Taliban has said, give us the proof. Bush refuses. We will go to war rather
than release the proof.
Is this a violation of basic American principles? Is it because there is no
proof? Is it just pure hypocrisy because we would never turn over someone to
another government without proof? Or is it because that after Bush's
speaking of "crusades" and "dead or alive" that he is intentionally inflaming
part of the world at us? And we wonder why they hate us?
The horrors of last week will never be eased by the creation of more horrors.
We must seek out the best solutions, the best responses, that we can make,
rather than continue this headlong rush to war.
Kakki, you said it this war was "our" war. After the horrible
misunderstanding of last weekend (which I still feel badly about) please take
this as lovingly as I can: do not speak of this as "our" war unless that "our"
includes you. Enlist, please. Be up front about it. My son Jeremy turns 25
today. No one has a clue where he is. He is a Marine, a grunt, he will be in
the first wave. I pick up my grandson Gage very soon. Can you imagine how I
feel right now? It is another way that I connect to the horrors of all the
families who lost loved ones last week - and to the families who may lose
loved ones in what is to come. I am hearing a lot on intellectual head
tripping from you Kakki, on these things. We are talking war. Our nation
ignored the terror in Rwanda, Nigeria, Timor, Chiapas, Bosnia, Ireland, all in
the last decade. Your man Bush opposed the peacekeeping action to stop the
terrorism in Kosovo and also said the ongoing terrorism in Israel-Palestine
was not our affair. Now as a nation we have suffered a small part of what
others have experienced and we are in a rush to respond, a rush to war. I
don't have the answers, I don't pretend to, but so that the horrors of last
week are not continued, in my own opinion, we must count the human costs and
stop the headlong rush to war that we are in now.
If we go to war, this war is not my war.
It is not God's way and I must cling to that.
"The nations are in an uproar, the kingdoms totter; he utters his voice,
the earth melts. The LORD of hosts is with us; the God of Jacob is our
refuge. Come, behold
the works of the LORD; see what desolations he has brought on the
earth. He makes wars cease to the end of the earth; he breaks the bow,
and shatters the spear; he burns the shields with fire. "Be still, and
know that I am God! I am exalted among
the nations, I am exalted in the earth." The LORD of hosts is with us;
the God of Jacob is our refuge." (Psalm 46)
"Some take pride in chariots, and some in horses, but our pride is in
the name of the LORD our God. They will collapse and fall, but we shall
rise and stand
upright." (Psalm 20)
"The LORD looks down from heaven; he
sees all humankind. From where he sits enthroned he watches all the
inhabitants of the earth-- he who fashions the hearts of them all, and
observes all their deeds. A king is not saved by his great army; a
warrior is not delivered by his great strength. The war horse is a vain
hope for victory, and by its great might it cannot save." (Psalm 33)
I am not called to rally around the military for any answer the military
has is a vain hope. I support the people in the military. And I do not
yield one fractional of a decimal in my Americanism.
We always pray for the president, whomever it may be, but I am not
called to rally around the president.
And while this nation has a military and will have a military and in the
real world in which we dwell, it has its purpose - I am proud of our
service as peacekeepers in Kosovo for example - the military has a
purpose but never an answer, they are never a solution. Osama Bin
Laden does need to be dealt with but there are other ways than military
madness.
I do caution against demonizing Bin laden - I can take you on a trip
to White Christian Churches in Michigan, Illinois, and the West where
any number of clergy will tell you it is the duty of Christians to kill
Muslims. (In fact, we have a whole church history about that, its
called the Crusades, and could also take in the Inquisition if you want
to include Jews, and then that would take in the Holocaust...)
Bin Laden is a terrorist but do we go to war with Afghanistan
for the acts of an individual and his followers? How many will die
then?
Bin Laden can be dealt with without war. For those of us who are Christians
we are called to
witness to the Gospel of peace, Put the sword - Jesus' last command
before his crucifixion. I pray that the President - particularly and
especially this president - get some wisdom. And I support our military
people; my own son will in the first lines of those whom you would send
off to war, sent to kill the sons of others who just happened to be born
where they live, as we happened to be born here. And that killing will
not advance the Gospel.
The attacks were heinous. The horror is beyond comprehension. The victims
of hatred include the
perpetrators of these actions, for they were killed by the hate, and
what a horrid life they lived, to be consumed by some hate. As Jesus
has taught me to pray for the forgiveness of my sins as I forgive
others, I have the task of forgiveness ahead of me - a huge task. As an
American, I also have the task of advocating for a realistic, measured,
effective response. And that is not in our nation playing the role of
the general in the Gladiator movie, crying "unleash hell."
"In Judah God is known, his name is great in Israel. His abode has been
established in Salem, his dwelling place in Zion. There he broke the
flashing arrows, the shield, the sword, and the weapons of war.
Glorious are you, more majestic than the everlasting mountains. The
stouthearted were stripped of their spoil; they sank into sleep; none of
the troops was able to lift a hand. At your rebuke, O God of Jacob,
both rider and horse lay stunned. But you indeed are awesome!" (Psalm
76)
