Randall Shimizu wrote:
There is probably 3 or 4 areas hurdles for Linux to become widely accepted
[Snip]
I don't either. You don't need to duplicate Windows to duplicate the
functionality of the Windows OS or applications. To keep with the
example I
started with, Linux SQLedger needs to be able to do online banking and
be easier to install and set up to better compete with Quickbooks in
the
accounting space. It currently can't. Adding this capability to
SQLedger
isn't duplicating Windows, but it is offering equivalent fucntionality.
principles that shaped the Unix environment appeal to me; they open
possibilities for very different ways of developing desktop
applications.
[Snip]
Now I hope this doesn't sound like piling on
Randall because it's not but there is an
interesting thought I had about this whole
discussion...
First the OS is is most definitely not the
application and its capabilities. I think this
type of thinking is the Windows trade rag type
of thinking about the relationship between the
OS and the apps that run on the OS. That is an
important thinking pattern where marketing to
some real but contrived "happiness" quotient and
subsequent product adoption and an eventual
bottom line profit for the sale **of the thing
itself** is the inviolate end all and be all for
the existence of the company/OS and the apps
that run on the OS.
Linux doesn't suffer from this contrived
relationship. Things get built because they can
be built and they don't even have to be usefully
functional at the v.01Beta release. There is a
"Wow, that really can be done factor" married to
the GPL type idea that it will/maybe
incrementally improved until it is fully
functional. Compared to 1993-1999 and even
1999-2004, Linux today it light years advanced
in the broad range of apps that work with the
kernel. The has no meaning to a Windows only user.
But that's not really your point. I think you
concede that Linux is not Windows and probably
shouldn't be but what about all those people who
don't use Linux and are the subject of this
Linux "Desktop" adoption craze? Well what about
them? We know how they participate in computing
technology, the Linux world needs to present
them with an analog that mimics their experience
without the brokenness that they really don't
even notice. That has nothing to do with Linux
being standardized.
I have been helping someone who is a Windows
programmer set things up at his house so he has
an environment that mirrors work. They use a
bunch of Windows workstations for those who need
them and the entire back end is Linux. But they
also use Ubuntu so now he is motivated to learn.
Now most of us have used Linux long enough to
know that what you see on the display device is
a result of an X server, display manager and
presentation manager in a client server
relationship. The Windows user and even advanced
Windows user will usually find this to be one of
the most unfathomable concepts they have ever
run across. Similarly things like Samba and how
resources are shared across the network is a
little less mysterious but it is a monumental
crisis for them to conceptualize that some free,
couple megabyte server app and a well configured
flat file is something they can personally own
and that the difference between 10's of
thousands of dollars of per seat licenses and
the same functionality for free is a free and
legal download (Windows/Linux configuration
expertise being a wash). There are many examples
(distro package installs) of lack of even
awareness how what has always been in front of
them works and it has never made a difference in
their experience. We don't need to change Linux
to BE what they are used to they just need a
distro that lets them SEE what they are used to.
The rest of us can then ignore that distro and
continue to enjoy the flexibility we want.
But again their inability to comprehend doesn't
mean they don't exist and that they aren't the
"800lb gorilla bending the Linux tree". So what?
I think Linux has the flexibility to create a
distro that presents itself as a desktop surface
experience that doesn't feel any different from
what they have now. Ubuntu/Kubuntu (even THAT is
difficult for them to comprehend) wants to do
this but while they are very, very close they
still ask questions on install and present the
end users with tasks to get multimedia running
that make the end user face reality. Otherwise
installing packages with Aptitude or Adept
pretty much isolates them from the messy details
of apt-get and dpkg which they don't know about
and don't care about and won't care about until
much later after they reach their analogous
"happiness" quotient. Refugee Windows users
aren't ready for details yet. Their Linux distro
should put the learning curve on the other side
of a clean, ready to sing and dance distro
installation (That means codecs are in place
right after install; Windows can do it but it
will take a little more time for Linux).
Help? They don't use help, they just stick the
install disk in and select the defaults...
Training? Never been to any... Windows "Just
Works!" (i.e. I don't know squat about how it
works and I don't wanna know squat about how it
works!)
Books? Haven't bought or read one in 5-6 years
outside of school or work...
Finally I think whether any given accounting
program (app) does or doesn't do double entry
accounting (feature) and how well it acts as an
interface for online activities is a whole
separate matter that is an application
requirements, programming and perhaps interface
reverse engineering issue that doesn't come
anywhere close to needing to make things like
installation package method or
display/presentation manager subsystem or file
system support homogenized for the sake of
people who don't even know these things happen
even on their current Windows system. In fact I
have been telling people the real importance of
Google Apps (and anybody that makes that kind of
on-line thing) is that they are making an end
run around the whole OS/Hardware paradigm that
has always ultimately had the ability to limit
applications in some way by being a toll booth
to get to the applications. This is very good
news for us that want to use Linux. When it
doesn't matter what your OS/Hardware combination
and configuration is to run applications then
some big multi-billion dollar company can't
screw around with the TCP/IP stack and break
your application, or change the system calls
that forces you into a major, from the ground up
rewrite OR worst of all force a rewrite of
everything in your app because their pissing
match with some other company that is the basis
of your app has been destroyed,
extended-embraced-destroyed or just wore out
some small company with a good idea who decided
to take the buyout even though their idea will
now be buried.
Linux and apparently Google no longer wants to
be involved in this nonsense anymore.
I say "Don't ask them what they want, and don't
tell them how they get what they want". It will
be our little secret until they are motivated to
learn more. If that means never, I'm good with
that too.
RB (A thought provoked by a good thread with a
liberal sprinkling of rant, with apologies ;^) W
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