Ron
Because people don't read what really is written:
People got one name and only one in baptize but are known by patrynom and farm name later, usually not all three together. In fact there were not any Family name.
From church records we usually get the Fathers name and mothers name the farm they lived at that time.
Before that time in Norway (bet. 1650-1700) from what time church records are known I have to research and "construct" a three part name from different informations, and the main goal is to identify the farm and patrynomics a substitude for Family name.
I could with a very common example from my part of Norway:
Jon on Fjeldsg�rd (known tax record 1593 with two sons
Olaf (Jonsson) and Sven (Jonsson) Known from taxlists early 1600 and 1624 Ownership lists to have divided the farm Fjeldsg�rd in two parts. Lets say I know that Svens wife was a Anna Torgrimsdaugther.
Lets say that I from 1647 tax lists know this.
Jon (1) owns 1/2 of Fjeldsg�rd
Jon (2) own 1/4 (Using 1/2 the farm) and Torgrim on Berg owns 1/4 of Fjeldsg�rd
As you see Jon 1 and Jon 2 are cousins, both named after their grand father. We have one way two sort out the two Jons and what is the patrynomics:
And that is Torgrim owning the one half together with Jon 2. He is obvious son of Anna and therfor a Svensson, as his brother . That leaves us with Jon 1 as son of Olaf.
Such an identification can't be done without using Patrynomics and Farmnames/ownership.
My conclution is that if Legacy want to exspand in Europe, even the rest of the world to, Americans have to learn that they are a minor part of the world, a world that has a lot of name traditions.
Other Programs has discovered that, like TMG for insytance.
I don't understand why some hide behind the GedCom standard to avoid improvements in Legacy
Kristian in Norway
P� Sun, 20 Jun 2004 12:20:38 -0700, skrev Ron Klotz-Zellhoefer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
One thing that seems to have gone completely over everyone's head in this
discussion is re: using farmnames as surnames. Farmnames are Locations, and
statedly are not permanent surnames, as they change when someone moves. It
would also be quite impossible to rely on a possible/probable/absolute
relationship where many different families might occupy the same farm during
a generation or two.
Sorry, just a dense german-american here, and I don't get it!
RonKZ
----- Original Message ----- From: "Kristian Fjeldsg�rd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, 20 June 2004 09:53 Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Name Prefix and Suffix/Middle name field
Dennis
Refering to my offensive language could you tell me:
1. How does Prefix or Surfic tell anything about a individuells family relations? Or blood herritage? How to sort?
2. Where have I written implementing a middle name field means to put farm
name into MNF and Patrynmics in Surname fiel.
I have suggested the opposite:
My option is:
Middle name: Patrynomics/ Maternal names/ Nick names etc
Surname/Family name field: Family names/Farm names/Nobility names.
If Millenia/Legacy wants to take the step over the Atlantic they have to devole: Middle name field. If Americans wants to be put into an American bag, that's up to you.
Kristian in Norway
P� Sun, 20 Jun 2004 12:11:53 -0400, skrev Dennis Kowallek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
On Sun, 20 Jun 2004 17:43:53 +0200, Kristian Fjeldsg�rd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
To go to the hard points:
[snip offensive language]
1. To me, prefix, given name, surname, and suffix are all PARTS of a name
structure. As would be middle name if it were implemented.
2. In my opinion, implementing a middle name field and putting a farm name in it would be just as wrong as putting the farm name in either prefix or suffix.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
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