Linux-Advocacy Digest #837, Volume #25 Mon, 27 Mar 00 12:13:10 EST
Contents:
Re: Top 10 reasons why Linux sux (Robert Heininger)
Re: Penquins Forever! Was (Re: A pox on the penguin?) (Robert Heininger)
Re: To all Windows 2000/98/95 Fans (Robert Heininger)
Re: joys of command-line image manipulation ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Strange idea ("Erna Odelfsan")
80286 Question : was : I WAS WRONG (Robert Heininger)
Re: Giving up on Tholen (and Bob shows his lack of knowledge yet again) (Jeff Glatt)
Re: Giving up on NT (Bob shows his lack of knowledge yet again) (Jim Stuyck)
Re: Peter Norton is one smart dude ("Christopher Smith")
Re: Giving up on NT (Bob shows his lack of knowledge yet again) (Joseph)
Re: Why did we even need NT in the first place? (Robert Heininger)
Re: 80286 Question : was : I WAS WRONG ("Erna Odelfsan")
Re: Peter Norton is one smart dude ("Drestin Black")
Re: What should be the outcome of Microsoft antitrust suit. (Mark Robinson)
Re: Peter Norton is one smart dude ("Christopher Smith")
Re: Giving up on NT (Bobo shows his hypocrisy yet again) (When in LA)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Heininger)
Subject: Re: Top 10 reasons why Linux sux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 15:40:07 GMT
On Mon, 27 Mar 2000 01:06:25 +0200,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> `Daniel O'Nolan' wrote:
>: > > > Jim
>: > > AFAIK, Star Office's web browser supports almost as much stuff as
>: > > netscape, including Java if you have it installed.
>: >
>: > Yes.
>: > I wish the parts were seperate though.
>: > I've only got a PII/300 to run it on..
>: > Jim
>: Yeah, I know what you mean. I'm running 64MB on my box, and it is still
>: running too darn slow, even running only one document, and under
>: windowmaker.
Heck, WindozeNT chokes-n-pukes all over itself when confronted with 64mb ram,
too. I have 128mb of ram in a 300mhz PII, and Star Office runs just fine.
--
Robert Heininger __
# / / __ _ _ _ _ __ __ #
# / /__ / / / \// //_// \ \/ / #
# /____/ /_/ /_/\/ /___/ /_/\_\ #
# The Choice of the GNU Generation #
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Heininger)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Penquins Forever! Was (Re: A pox on the penguin?)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 15:44:59 GMT
On Mon, 27 Mar 2000 01:00:33 +0200,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> `Matthias Warkus' wrote:
>: It was the Sun, 26 Mar 2000 02:17:46 GMT...
>: ...and ax <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>: >
>: > "2 + 2" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>: > news:8b62hc$g8p$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>: > > BTW, little known facts about penquins.
>: > >
>: > > Penquins are quite clumsy on land.
>: > >
>: > > But in the sea, penquins fly like birds when they swim.
>: > >
>: >
>: > But in Linux, all penguins are lazy sitting with round belly.
>: > They cannot walk or fly. They cannot even stand up
>: > with fat belly. Linux penguins must have been eating
>: > too much "free" stuff.
>:
>: Ever played "Tux the Penguin: A Quest For Herring"? The Linux penguin
>: can indeed run, jump and swim. Maybe even fly.
Is that a Linux game? Playstion's and Dreamcast's are for playing games, not
computers. Why even bother, if it is?
>: mawa
>: --
>: Paulg's Law:
>: In America, it's not how much an
>: item costs, it's how much you save.
--
Robert Heininger __
# / / __ _ _ _ _ __ __ #
# / /__ / / / \// //_// \ \/ / #
# /____/ /_/ /_/\/ /___/ /_/\_\ #
# The Choice of the GNU Generation #
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Heininger)
Subject: Re: To all Windows 2000/98/95 Fans
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 15:48:46 GMT
On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 18:35:11 -0800,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> `Trevor Fuson' wrote:
>: R.E.Ballard ( Rex Ballard ) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>: news:8bdlr2$8rv$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>: > Only the original Linux kernel is new. Much of the code has been
>: > production hardened for over 20 years (when UNIX systems were
>:
>: > Microsoft still has a lot to learn about process management, library
>: > management, interprocess communications, process scheduling, and
>: > memory management, but Windows 2000 is certainly Microsoft's best
>: > operating system to date.
>: Microsoft has people that have been working on this stuff since 1975. In
>: fact some of NT's source code could date back as far as 1981.
So apparently it took Microsoft almost two decades to actually make something
even remotely useful out of it?
--
Robert Heininger __
# / / __ _ _ _ _ __ __ #
# / /__ / / / \// //_// \ \/ / #
# /____/ /_/ /_/\/ /___/ /_/\_\ #
# The Choice of the GNU Generation #
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: joys of command-line image manipulation
Date: 27 Mar 2000 11:12:13 -0500
"Drestin Black" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> me, I just highlight the files, open ACDSee and click on Convert and pick
> the destination format, or maybe pick rotate 90 degress clockwise, or
> whatever and don't have time to sit and write posts cause it's done
> already...
Not quite. Sounds like you have a tool that can do image manipulation
on multiple files, which is better than nothing, but still not nearly as
powerful as even my simple script.
Being optimistic, and assuming ACDSee is powerful enough to do all these
things, here are the steps:
1. Highlight the files.
2. Copy them to the x360 directory.
3. Highlight the copies in the x360 directory.
4. Run ACDSee (multiple times you really mean "or" above) to
scale the images down
convert them to grayscale
rotate
5. Copy the copies from the x360 directory to the x24 directory.
6. Highlight the copies in the x24 directory.
7. Run ACDSee to scale them down to thumbnail size.
As opposed to typing, e.g. for the latest 19 images:
./evcam `ls -tr | tail -19`
That's definitely worth the 8 lines of shell script I had to write
exactly once. With 200 employee photos still on the way in batches of
1-20, I'm glad I didn't go with your solution.
--
Bruce R. Lewis <URL:http://web.mit.edu/brlewis/www/>
------------------------------
From: "Erna Odelfsan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Strange idea
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:12:31 GMT
Is it closed software another way of sharing a project ? I mean, while
open source encourages sharing coding applications, closed software
encourages you to pay them for doing that. How many things have Microsoft
done since its creation ? More or less than open source ? (I ask) If it has
done more (it succeeded a lot, failed another), does it mean money support
is better than brain support for software projects to get done ?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Heininger)
Subject: 80286 Question : was : I WAS WRONG
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:11:34 GMT
On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 23:11:33 -0500,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> `mlw' wrote:
{deletia}
>: I have never seen an 8086/8088 version of Xenix. I have worked the 80286
>: version. Could it be that qdos was a better choice because it resembled
>: (the term 'port' may be appropriate) CP/M, and that Xenix could not run
>: on the original real-mode '86 processor?
>:
>: It wasn't until the 80286 that the Intel P.C. line had an MMU. Although
>: the 8086 segments were a poor man's MMU. It isn't as if it isn't doable,
>: I guess, I just wonder if they did it.
>:
>: This is something I've always wanted to see documented. Computers were
>: pretty small in 1979.
I've asked this question before in another news group and got some good
answers, but this seems like a much better place to get them because you folks
really know your stuff, :-) so I'm trying it again.
Are there any non-MS OS's (ie. DOS) still available that will run on
a 80286 machine that I would like to use as just an Internet gateway utilizing
ip forwarding, for a small lan? I have one of these 'lil 'ol boxes collecting
dust and desire to give it one last mission in life before it's finally
retired to a scrap heap.
Thanks in advance.
--
Robert Heininger __
# / / __ _ _ _ _ __ __ #
# / /__ / / / \// //_// \ \/ / #
# /____/ /_/ /_/\/ /___/ /_/\_\ #
# The Choice of the GNU Generation #
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jeff Glatt)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: Giving up on Tholen (and Bob shows his lack of knowledge yet again)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:24:08 GMT
>"Joe Malloy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Well, Marty, Tholen tholened himself into another flub:
>
>> > Having deleted the evidence for what you actually wrote, I don't need
>> > to characterize your action, George. It speaks for itself.
>>
>> If it "speaks for itself" then why did you post this follow-up? Typical
>> inconsistency.
>
>You found the inconsistency -- now note how Tholen tries to wriggle out of
>it!
His inconsistency "speaks for itself"
------------------------------
From: Jim Stuyck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: Giving up on NT (Bob shows his lack of knowledge yet again)
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:26:19 GMT
Joe Ragosta wrote:
> In article <8bjpph$p1e$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jason Bowen) wrote:
>
> >
> > So if we have a conversation about I have to bring up the item being
> > talked about each time? It is never implicity referenced? The 92
> > million was added to IBM's bottom line from OS/2. The 92 million that we
> > were talking about was part of IBM's revenue. OS/2 contributed 92
> > million
> > as I said in my previous statements, and I was wondering what you think
> > that means for OS/2. Would you like to talk about the 92 million IBM
> > says
> > OS/2 generated for it? That is an awkward way of communicating that you
> > need, the inability to reference what is being talked about from previous
> > statements.
> >
>
> I think you might want to start by taking some basic economics courses.
>
> Start by learning the difference between "revenue" and "bottome line".
You make a valid point, Joe.
Esther Schindler's article in "Sm@rt Reseller", the source of the "$92 million"
number, reads thus:
The OS/2 business line contributed $92 million to IBM's bottom line in
1999, say sources. Most of the increased sales performance was in
OS/2 client sales, which were at $46 million, sources added.
Confusing, 'eh? If you assume "apples and apples," then it *appears* Esther's
numbers are both sales, although most of $92 million, or $46 million, isn't
"most of" in my sense of measurement (it's half). But if the "92 million" was
actually a "bottom line" (after burden), then the "$46 million" in "sales"
wouldn't
come close to "most of." So, I'm leaning to both numbers being "sales."
What I find disappointing is the $46 million in OS/2 client sales. That's maybe
only 500,000 (or fewer) copies, WAY down from numbers bandied about a few
years ago. In addition, $46 million in sales might support about 200-300
employees, give or take, WAY down from the numbers that once were
employed in Boca Raton/Austin on OS/2.
Actually, "confusing numbers" have been the one *consistent* thing coming
from IBM in regards to OS/2 sales!
> Now, which was it? Did OS/2 add $92 M in revenue or $92 M to the bottom
> line. If the former, how much did it really add to the bottom line?
Jim Stuyck
------------------------------
From: "Christopher Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Peter Norton is one smart dude
Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 02:30:29 +1000
"George Marengo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On 27 Mar 2000 04:50:32 GMT, "Stephen S. Edwards II"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >W. Kiernan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >
> >: Mark Hamstra wrote:
> >: >
> >: > "W. Kiernan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >: >
> >: > > Was it really Chad Myers who wrote?:
> >: > > >
> >: > > > ...NTFS, which has journaling.
> >: > >
> >: > > It does? That's news to me.
> >: >
> >: > You shouldn't be so quick to broadcast your ignorance.
> >
> >: I shouldn't ask questions, you mean. I should learn by telepathy,
> >: osmosis, however you do it, you bigdeal genius you.
> >
> >You're answer did, IMHO, denote a slight flavor of sarcasm. NTFS is
> >indeed a journaled filesystem. Perhaps you thought NTFS to be much like
> >FAT16?
>
> Are you talking about NTFS or NTFS5?
>
Erm, it doesn't matter. NTFS has been a (metdata) journaling FS since its
inception.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 08:35:35 -0500
From: Joseph <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: Giving up on NT (Bob shows his lack of knowledge yet again)
George Marengo wrote:
>
> On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 21:48:33 -0500, Joseph <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >George Marengo wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:51:44 GMT, Joseph <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> <snip>
> >> >The ideal man:
> >>
> >> That's your characterization, not mine.
> >>
> >> >He has strong IBM-OS/2 opinions and when shown facts
> >> >contradicting his understanding of the past, the information
> >> >is called "uninteresting."
> >>
> >> Should I lie and call it something that, in my opinion, it isn't?
> >
> >Isn't the question, "Shouldn't you tell the truth?"
>
> That's what I did -- told the truth. Did you have some point to make?
Yes and I made my point.
> >I would say anyone holding strong opinions as you do who
> >hasn't read the FOF and thinks it is boring is - by the definition
> >of the word and in thissubject area - ignorant. Ignorant people
> >can form opinions.
>
> While I've read specific parts of the FoF, I admit that I'm ignorant
> of the majority of what's in the FoF.
Repeat
Until FOF is read.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Robert Heininger)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why did we even need NT in the first place?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:43:12 GMT
On Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:41:24 +0100,
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> `Eddie Dubourg' wrote:
>: Daniel O'Nolan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>:
>: > Some people still beleive that this is true! I recently got into a huge
>: > argument with a tech at a software store because he claimed that DOS 7
>: > was EMULATED. It amazes me how dullards like that can get jobs at
>: > computer stores.
>:
>: Anyone who knows anything about computers would not work in a computer
>: store - posts there are reserved for tech wannabes.
People like me : who work in manufacturing *and* know computers, despise tech.
wannabe's in every definition of the term.
heh. . I recently had to explain to some dufus behind the counter of a local
auto barn, the difference between Ford's 351 big block (351m) and the hyper
'lil Windsor, when looking for parts for a `79 Bronco. At least this guy was
somewhat perceptive to what I had to offer.
Similar isn't true for the idiot at Comp-USA tho', who tried to lecture me
about how my BIOS might not be able to recognize large media a few weeks ago.
Jeez, you're using Linux, you better be careful d00d! : he says. Give me a
`Fn' break already will ya, and go get a *REAL* job somewhere! Sheez!
It's all relative.
--
Robert Heininger __
# / / __ _ _ _ _ __ __ #
# / /__ / / / \// //_// \ \/ / #
# /____/ /_/ /_/\/ /___/ /_/\_\ #
# The Choice of the GNU Generation #
------------------------------
From: "Erna Odelfsan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: 80286 Question : was : I WAS WRONG
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:51:05 GMT
I think TSX runs on 80286, and that Xenix runs too; I've heard of a
project to port Linux to 80286 CPU's, but never heard it again, not sure if
it ever became to something or abandoned.
------------------------------
From: "Drestin Black" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Peter Norton is one smart dude
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 11:50:54 -0500
"abraxas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8bnqg8$n6l$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy abraxas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >> "W. Kiernan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >>> Mark Hamstra wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> > "W. Kiernan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >>> >
> >>> > > Was it really Chad Myers who wrote?:
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > ...NTFS, which has journaling.
> >>> > >
> >>> > > It does? That's news to me.
> >>> >
> >>> > You shouldn't be so quick to broadcast your ignorance.
> >>>
> >>> I shouldn't ask questions, you mean. I should learn by telepathy,
> >>> osmosis, however you do it, you bigdeal genius you.
>
> >> Of course! <grin>
>
> >> NTFS 5 (which is implemented in Windows2000 and read by NT 4.0 SP4 and
higher)
> >> has a change journal.
>
> > Neat. Now its just like MacOS 7.5.1.
>
> Oh, and BeOS DR3.0, IRIX and Purgatory/Inferno.
>
> Catch up microsoft! Catch up! Tell us you invented it! We'll believe
you!
>
maybe Linux will catchup some day later too and claim Linus wrote it.
------------------------------
From: Mark Robinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What should be the outcome of Microsoft antitrust suit.
Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:55:26 GMT
ccghst wrote:
>
> David Goldstein wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
> >"[EMAIL PROTECTED]" wrote:
> >>
> >> There should be a law that a customer must have a right to buy any PC
> >> without any operating system installed.
> >> This will give a customer choice of any OS, or if someone aleady have
> >> Win on desktop, why he/she have to pay to M$ an additional fee for OS
> >> on laptop?
> >
> > We just had a discussion about this at work yesterday. My opinion was
> >pretty much the same as yours--do not allow companies to sell computers
> >with OS's preinstalled.
>
> As an option, the right to buy without an OS is probably
> a good one. There is a major practical problem with
> -forbidding- machine vendors from preinstalling. It
> could be a tech-support nightmare.
>
> One reason vendors who do allow you the flexibility of
> choosing your OS still refuse to sell the systems without
> an OS is that it makes phone support much more difficult.
> It is extremely time consuming to determine, for example,
> whether certain hardware isn't working because the
> hardware is defective, or if the customer is in fact using
> an unsupported version of their OS (didn't install the
> patches, didn't compile the driver properly, etc.)
Actually they could have several options
1) Windows. Add $0. With tech support
2) Free Unix. Subtract $60. With tech support
...
5) Nothing. Subtract $100. No tech support.
>
> Plus a certain segment of the population is just too dim
> to do an OS install, even with friendly menus, etc.
>
> The politics would make that impossible.
------------------------------
From: "Christopher Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Peter Norton is one smart dude
Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 03:00:17 +1000
"abraxas" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8bnq94$n6l$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > "W. Kiernan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> Mark Hamstra wrote:
> >> >
> >> > "W. Kiernan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >> >
> >> > > Was it really Chad Myers who wrote?:
> >> > > >
> >> > > > ...NTFS, which has journaling.
> >> > >
> >> > > It does? That's news to me.
> >> >
> >> > You shouldn't be so quick to broadcast your ignorance.
> >>
> >> I shouldn't ask questions, you mean. I should learn by telepathy,
> >> osmosis, however you do it, you bigdeal genius you.
>
> > Of course! <grin>
>
> > NTFS 5 (which is implemented in Windows2000 and read by NT 4.0 SP4 and
higher)
> > has a change journal.
>
> Neat. Now its just like MacOS 7.5.1.
Eh ? Since when was HFS journalled ?
------------------------------
From: When in LA
Reply-To: When in LA
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy
Subject: Re: Giving up on NT (Bobo shows his hypocrisy yet again)
Date: 27 Mar 2000 17:06:54 GMT
On Sun, 27 Mar 3900 06:55:27, Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
|Looks like you were so "riled up" that you were too flustered to respond to my
|article.
|
|I noticed how you neatly removed everything in your response.
No the post was getting too long and the important points were getting
buried in your barrage of flak.
|Choosing to run
|away from the facts *again*, eh Bobo?
I realize that you feel you benefit from filling the discussion with a
lot of fact. I am pruning for clarity, you are posting for obscurity.
[more flak deleted]
|> A. You claim I have offered no substantiation. This is false.
|Liar. There is no admission on Sutherland's part of him attempting to get
|Tholen fired for using a particular word. True or false?
False, read the signature box in particular Sutherlands post that said
the following: "Tholen used "queer" as an
insult and a means to attack someone. This is discriminatory. He did
so from his employers account. His employer has a policy against
discrimination. Tholen acted against the policies of his employer.
Tholens employer is now aware of this.
And Sutherlands post: "If I posted anything remotely like Tholen's
"queer" comments with my employers name
anywhere within that message, I would be escorted to the door,
and rightly so."
|> The substantiation that Sutherland tried to get Tholen fired is
|> provided in my signature box.
|
|No substantiation to be seen there. I see loosely connected innuendo coupled
|with misleading editorial comments, but no substantiation whatsoever.
Saying I am going to "blow your head off" and saying "I did blow his
head off" may not be an admission to "murder" in your book, but you
are just a weird guy.
|> B. David Sutherland produced only one of his alleged letters he
|> claimed he sent to officials at UofH. You are incorrect in saying
|> that he stated in that letter than he did not want Tholen treated
|> harshly. What he said Marty is he did not want Tholen "flogged",
|
|Having trouble comprehending his metaphor too? Not surprising. The reader
|will note that "getting flogged" was used as a metaphor for harsh treatment,
|as opposed to a "slap on the wrist" being a metaphor for getting off easy.
Note how Mr Interference for the Usenet Spy can easly determine what
the Usenet Spy meant by "getting flogged" but he has trouble inferring
what he intended by contacting Tholen's employer and complaining about
Tholen's use of the word "queer."
Whats the matter Marty? Have trouble with inferences that require
more than one word?
|> Several things are wrong with this evidence:
|> 1) Sutherland did not send the original message via usenet,
|
|Which is precisely what gives it merit. He sent it directly to the U of H,
|contrary to any piece of "evidence" you have presented. As such it has
|infinitely more weight than anything posted in this public forum.
Usenet does not record what was sent to UofH, thus the usenet record
is of an "alleged" note, not the actual note.
|> thus the only copy we have is an alleged reproduction submitted by
|> Sutherland, claiming this is the letter he sent.
|
|Tholen verified that this was, in fact, the letter sent to the U of H.
Evidence please
|> 2) Sutherland claimed sending more than one communication, yet he
|> has failed to produce the other communications even though asked to.
|
|Evidence, please. We can only go by the evidence presented, contrary to your
|tendancy to fill in the blanks with what you'd like to see.
Your wish is my command Marty.
Sutherlands post on May 2 1999:
BO>You told us David. It was Judith, "the lovely lady who reads the
UofH
BO>presidents' inbox".
DS| Are you claiming she was the only one?
DS| I state that I was in communication with more than Judith over
this matter. If you want to call me a
DS| liar, then do it - and I'll get those other people to confirm
their involvement.
|> 3) Since by your own admission, Sutherland can not control whether
|> Tholen would get fired, and considering that Sutherland believed in
|> his own words below that the appropriate punishment would be firing;
|
|Wrong. Sutherland believed that his employer would have fired him had
|Sutherland done such a thing. He does not know of the environment of Tholen's
|employers or what they will or will not tolerate.
Pure hogwash Marty. I suppose you would argue in court, in defense of
the guy who ran somebody down with his auto, that he didn't intend to
kill him because he had not given the guy a physiological examination
and therefore had not determined if the guy was vulnerable to being
damaged by the car. Your argument is laughable Marty.
|> claiming that the language Sutherland submitted in his letter to the
|> UofH is little more than the equivalent of a guy yelling "Don't Die
|> you Bastard" as he uses his auto to run his enemy down.
|
|Not even close. As you have just admitted, Sutherland was powerless to cost
|Tholen his employment. Hence the "auto" was not in his hands, and his
|communications with those holding the "weapons" is of paramount importance in
|the case. How many times must I explain this to you?
Point taken however, since many employer's do not value the rights of
their workers and only look to their image and/or profits/funding
sources for ultimate employment decisions, they often operate like
automobiles in an unthinking way towards the rights of their
employees.
Sutherland's comment: "If I posted anything remotely like Tholen's
"queer" comments with my employers name
anywhere within that message, I would be escorted to the door, and
rightly so." is in fact verfication that Sutherland is aware of this.
Fortunately, Sutherland was wrong in his assessment of Tholen's
employer being like his employer.
|> C. Since it is clear that you have complained about the order of
|> statements in my signature box, and you have complained about the
|> editorial comments I added, I have several times now offered to remedy
|> those alleged faults. However, your response has been to delete
|> references to those offers in your replies which goes to show how
|> bankrupt your series of arguments.
|That is an absolute and utter lie. Had *you* not deleted them in this
|response, you might have seen my response. I'll reproduce it for you:
|BO> Tell me what order you want them in that you will find satisfactory.
|BO> In fact, I will even include dates they were said if you think that will
|BO> satisfy you. Also if you think removal of the editorial notes will aid
|BO> in reader comprehension and this satisfies you, I will remove them also.
|
|M> How about including your claim (following my statement) and removing the
|M> misleading commentary. Then while you're at it, substantiate or retract
|your
|M> claim.
Obviously you are not going to be reasonable.
|> D. Since the above three points compellingly demonstrate your lack of
|> forceful arguments,
|
|Not even close. Your act of deletion and the lies that followed clearly show
|you have no ground upon which to stand.
Grounds you may not comprehend, anyway, I will grant you that.
|> and you instead choose to attack me with a variety of juvenile insults,
|
|Such as "fartface", for example, hypocrite? Now I challenge you to locate a
|juvenile insult that *I* issued towards you.
OK
|Still blowing hot air?
|Typical illogic.
|Still having reading comprehension problems?
|How transparent can you get?
|Typical illogic.
|Just another Bobo lie.
|Typical pontification.
|No need, hypocrite:
|Still having reading comprehension problems?
| I see you're still enjoying your verbal masturbation.
| Still continuing your verbal masturbation, eh Bobo?
|Still having reading comprehension problems?
Instances limited to the I am responding to, in fact.
BobO
Marty Amodeo says: "If Glatt, Sutherland, yourself, or myself tried
to get someone fired for using a particular word it is a despicable
act."
David Sutherland made the following quotes in posts residing on
Dejanews:
If I posted anything remotely like Tholen's "queer" [Editor: Note
particular word in quotes] comments with my employers name
anywhere within that message, I would be escorted to the door,
and rightly so.[Editor: Note euphemism for firing]
If Tholen doesn't apologise in full, publicly and at great length, I
*will* advise his university, as this kind of bullshit *should* and
*will* be challenged.[Editor: Note threat]
I've asked Kenneth P. Mortimer, President, University of
Hawaii ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) for his opinion on how
certain members of the faculty are spending their time.[Editor: Note
admission to personal notification of employer]
Tholen used "queer" [Editor: Note particular word in quotes] as an
insult and a means to attack someone. This is discriminatory. He did
so from his employers account. His employer has a policy against
discrimination. Tholen acted against the policies of his employer.
Tholens employer is now aware of this. [Editor: Note reason for
contacting employer]
Pretty despicable, I have to agree Marty.
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