Linux-Advocacy Digest #958, Volume #26 Wed, 7 Jun 00 17:13:05 EDT
Contents:
Re: The State of the System Address ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: SVGALib (JEDIDIAH)
Re: Linux+Java, the best combination of techologies (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Microsoft OS, no full OS CD Re: More Dirty Microsoft Tactics (billy ball)
Re: New User here, and I think Linux Stinks! ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: HTML Help files (an updated set of man pages) (Pete Goodwin)
Re: The sad Linux story (Craig Kelley)
Re: Bob's Law (Mayor)
Re: windoze 9x, what a piece of shit! (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Please Advice Me ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Linux is so stable... (Pete Goodwin)
Re: SVGALib (Craig Kelley)
Re: HTML Help files (an updated set of man pages) (Greg Yantz)
Re: Linux is so stable... (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Microsoft OS, no full OS CD Re: More Dirty Microsoft Tactics (Craig Kelley)
Re: Linux is so stable... (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Microsoft OS, no full OS CD Re: More Dirty Microsoft Tactics
Re: Bob's Law ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: The State of the System Address
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:30:24 GMT
On Wed, 07 Jun 2000 04:01:48 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (CAguy) wrote:
>On Tue, 06 Jun 2000 21:37:42 GMT, Cihl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>[snip]
>
>>Problem is, that when users get used to using a certain OS daily, they
>>will use whatever works well, and avoid the rest. I think that's why
>>Windows users, and Mac users for that matter, usually avoid working
>>with two or more programs at the same time.
>>Typical features like the clipboard would therefore actually be more
>>useful to Linux than it is for Windows.
>
>So, you're saying windows doesn't run two or more programs well?
>Hmm...lets see what I'm running now:
I'm streaming 48 digital audio tracks through 4 effects busses (highly
FPU dependent, using FFT) and mixing down automatically while I am
typing this.
Oh yea I am using Windows 98 SE.
Linux chokes just running StarOffice and trying to print on the same
exact system. Mouse trails, jerky mouse pointer and so forth.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (JEDIDIAH)
Subject: Re: SVGALib
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:30:34 GMT
On Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:26:55 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>On 7 Jun 2000 05:32:53 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (David
>Steinberg) wrote:
>
>
>>
>>I was trying to steer him to a more valid comparion, and maybe messing
>>with his mind a little at the same time...
>>
>>Right, Simon...err...Steve?
>
>
>Simon. There are too many steve's in the group already.
>
>Anyway, I'm not sure what I am missing here as the geek-speak is
>growing by the minute and I don't speak geek.
>
>The guy wants a screen dump yes?
>
>What is the difference what library or application it is?
...the difference between there being a built in infastructure
already in place as well as a distinction between the enviroment
and the application, or not.
[deletia]
--
|||
/ | \
Need sane PPP docs? Try penguin.lvcm.com.
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux+Java, the best combination of techologies
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:38:58 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell) wrote in
<8hk0pa$1ctr$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Have you seen swing, or are you thinking of awt?
Not seen swing as yet.
>I thought beans just added a self-describing interface to the
>classes. What do they have to do with the GUI-ness?
I thought new controls were coming based on Beans. The self describing
interface is something that is built in with Borland's Delphi - did I read
somewhere that the Bean definition was aided by guys at Borland?
Pete
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (billy ball)
Subject: Re: Microsoft OS, no full OS CD Re: More Dirty Microsoft Tactics
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:38:50 GMT
On 7 Jun 2000 17:25:17 GMT, Darren Winsper
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On Wed, 7 Jun 2000 02:20:14 -0500, Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> From the third link:
>>
>> http://www.infoworld.com/articles/op/xml/00/06/05/000605opfoster.xml
>>
>> "Others opined that the large PC manufacturers, rather than Microsoft, might
>> be driving the no-CD bandwagon. "Microsoft may be removing the full Windows
>> CD to eliminate piracy, but there is another likely scenario," suggested one
>> official at a small PC manufacturer that does not license Windows directly
>> from Microsoft. "It's also possible that the major manufacturers asked
>> Microsoft to eliminate everything except the license to reduce their costs
>> and Microsoft said OK. I noted in your article [last week] that most of the
>> nasty-sounding quotes attributed to Microsoft actually came from
>> manufacturer's reps. I'll bet that the direct-license manufacturers could
>> buy and include the full package if they wanted to." "
>
>The problem is that is speculation, not fact.
the problem will be quite evident when people try to install new software,
services, or hardware, or install an alternative operating system...
(gee, why would anyone want to do that?)
some 'full-restore' CDs from manufacturers are accomodating... in particular,
the restore CD included with my AST Ascentia would only use the existing
VFAT partition to use during the restore... others, such as Compaq, IBM, Sony,
and so on, will wipe out any existing partitioning scheme and just restore to
factory condition...
i'm sure for most Windows users a full restore CD will be adequate
>
>--
>Darren Winsper (El Capitano) - ICQ #8899775
>Stellar Legacy project member - http://www.stellarlegacy.tsx.org
>DVD boycotts. Are you doing your bit?
>This message was typed before a live studio audience.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: New User here, and I think Linux Stinks!
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:42:13 GMT
You did one step better than me, sane locked my Linux system (Mandrake
7) tighter than a virgin on her wedding night.
BRS time...
In all fairness though, probing ports at the hardware level is nasty
stuff and chances are if Windows did the same thing, the results would
be similar.
But Windows recognizes modern PNP hardware quite well and unlike the
old days of Win95 does a very good job of setting things up.
Linux is a crap shoot, and even if your hardware happens to "work"
chances are good it won't perform up to it's capabilities.
On 7 Jun 2000 13:16:04 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Pete Goodwin) wrote:
>>>Under Linux /Sane?
>
>Sane thinks I don't have a scanner.
------------------------------
Subject: Re: HTML Help files (an updated set of man pages)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:43:12 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Richardson) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Perhaps he is saying that linux is better for _him_ than windows. I know
>I do. Perhaps windows is better for you, if so, you should consider
>sticking with windows. Not to discourage you from trying linux, but you
>don't post this stuff to any of the linux help newsgroups, just to
>advocacy, why is that?
I'm trying to point out to Linux bigots (i.e. not you as you're being
fairly reasonable in the style of conversation) that the rants and raves
they make is simply hot air!
>And yet you didn't know much about man pages or cut and paste in X?
I know enough about man pages to know it's an inferior help system. As for
cut and paste on X it seems to be a precursor of what I've seen on better
systems - by that I mean Windows.
Pete
------------------------------
Subject: Re: The sad Linux story
From: Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 07 Jun 2000 14:41:29 -0600
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> I didn't respond because I agree with what you posted. Your
>> statement "though you are correct in stating that it is not
>> technical" showed that.
>
> There was a "per se" at the end. Cathedral vs. Bazaar is a meta-
> technical argument. My stance is that the bazaar style of development
> is not conducive to a quality product, though most of my arguments
> concern the actual quality of the product (i.e. the actual technical
> issues).
>
> But anyways, "not technical" does not mean "political" which you
> stated. You said that I had a _political_ agenda. I need to know what
> you think this is.
Politicial : Pertaining to policy, or to civil government and its
administration.
The Cathedral vs. Bazaar is such a debate. I meant no disrespect, it
was simply an observation.
> > The debate twix the cathedral and the bazaar is young, we'll have to
> > wait to see what happens.
>
> Not really. It is still possible to debate the technical arguments of
> the design methodologies without seeing the results. In fact, basing
> your decision on the outcome is rather pedestrian reasoning; more
> people would want to understand why the methodology is better/worse
> which should be predictable from the out set.
But we all understand the proposed merits of both; we simply have no
proof.
> And, of course, I'd argue that the bazaar development is not new, but
> has been tried for 30 years, yielding most of Unix and its tools. Of
> course, Unix is perhaps the biggest technical blunder in the history of
> computing. So I'd conclude that bazaar development has proved that it
> cannot work.
There are several flaws with this assertion:
1) The failure of UNIX is your opinion; there are many, many, many
other people who do not share it. If the free market is any
gauge, Windows 9x is the best operating system ever (and I
wouldn't classify it as either strictly Cathedral or Bazaar
development, becuase it largely "grew" without architecture).
2) There are hundreds of other bazaar projects of great merit.
3) There are thousands of failed, or as you so eloquently put it
"technical blunders" of the cathedral model out there.
Certainly, we have much more experience with cathedral projects
because it is the prevailing model. If you take a course Organizational
Behavior, you'll find one of the first topics of consideration
is that of personality types. On the most basic level we have 2
distinct kinds: Type A and Type B. There are also other models which
explain behavior (Kelley's theory of attribution, the big 5 dimensions
of personality, Myers Brigg type indicator, etc.), which would
illustrate my point much better, but let's stick with A/B for now.
A type A person is competitive and wants to get ahead. These people
need to succeed at everyhting in order to fufill their ego, and they
generally take on moderate-level tasks; enough to satiate them but not
hard enough that failure would be likely.
A type B person is more laid back, not very competitive; easy-going.
They are more apt to work better in groups and to share ideas rather
than compete with eachother.
Most people are a mixture of the above, but it is pretty obvious that
they like different organizational models. There is no reason why the
Cathedral (high-J/T, for MBTI) and the Bazaar (high-S/E, for MBTI)
can't exist at the same time with neither being "better" than the
other. The Bazaar simply caters to different personality types than
the Cathedral does.
Each model has it's own merits and flaws. In the future, it may be
scientifically proven that one model is superior in most situations,
but I highly doubt that either one will be superior in *all*
situations. You can cite several examples in favor of the Cathedral.
Fine. Just realize that your's is a myopic viewpoint, and many simply
don't believe that the Cathedral is the way to go for every project.
> > And, Apple is using the bazaar now....
>
> To the horror of the software engineering community. It appears that
> any failing company will try anything to sell more stuff.
So, Apple is a bright pillar of the Cathedral one day and a failing
company trying anything (ie, the Bazaar) the next. Which is it?
Personally, I belive it is a blend... Quartz and Aqua are definately
Cathedral, while Darwin is certainly Bazaar.
> > Simple. Go get the backup tape. Use the -i alias for rm (I do it
> > with all my root accounts).
>
> The deletion confirm thing is not a solution.
It's never failed me.
> Users get used to just typing yes, and just do that
> everytime. People want to system to do its job, not get in the way
> like Linux and Windows like to do.
Any system has the ability to erase a file; it's all a matter of
degree.
> > Read the VMS end-user license sometime, I'm sure it revokes any and
> > all responsibility for anything that ever happens.
>
> Not really the point. It is almost impossible to delete files
> acidentally due to a typo on VMS. If there were rampant cases of this
> happening, DEC would be interested in figuring out the problem. The
> developers of Linux are not interesting in solving the problems, but in
> calling it a rite of passage.
If this feature is so important, why hasn't VMS taken off?
--
The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Bob's Law
From: Mayor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 13:43:25 -0700
In article <lwx%4.30045$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Bob Lyday writes:
>
>> Bob's Law invoked. Tholen mentioned. Thread is now
officially dead.
>
>Illogical.
>
Since when has logic had anything to do with Usenet?
--
Come and see my new website!
http://home.pacbell.net/rfovell/bozosity.html
Generously donated and maintained by
THE Robert Fovell of CSMA fame.
* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
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------------------------------
Subject: Re: windoze 9x, what a piece of shit!
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:46:21 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bart Oldeman) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>New
>Open
>Save
>Save as
>Preferences
>-----------
>Close
>Quit
>-----------
>Mail image
>Print
>
>with the default keybindings, which are ridiculously easy to change!
>
>I don't know about yours. Does it just miss the "Print" item?
Mine doesn't look like that. Funny, having Mail Merge and Print after Quit.
Seems an odd place to put them.
Pete
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Please Advice Me
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:46:41 GMT
Mandrake 7.x or SuSE would be my choice. If you choose Mandrake select
medium security (paranoid screws things up too much for a newbie) and
check your inetd script for open ports (ftp, telnet etc).
Both are fine Linux distributions IMHO and while I am not a Linux
supporter, if you really want to try it, I have found those 2
distributions to work quite well.
Good luck in your studies!
On Wed, 7 Jun 2000 14:20:22 -0500, horace franklin iii
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I am considering installing some version ofthe Linus OS on my PC. It just
>seems to me that there are too many versions. How do I decide which one
>is the best for me? There are the free versions, debian, etc. and I would
>even consider investing in some of the ones that must be
>purchased(Mandrake, red hat, etc.). The only thing I would like to know
>is that I'm getting the best product for the money to meet my computing
>needs. I'm not hardcore in multimedia, but I would at least want to be
>able to play all of my multimedia files. I'm a comupter science major, so
>a c/c++ compiler would be a must, a word processor, and a wide array of
>security settings would be appreciated. Also I'd need full supply of
>driver support. I'm open to any type of input you could offer, whether it
>applies directly to my questions or not. I'm not very familiar with Linux
>so I would like to learn as much about Linux itself as possible.
>References to good artices or websites are also welcome. Please help me
>if you can. Thank you in advance for your time, and your help. Please
>reply directly to me.
>
>Horace
>
>Work as though it all depends on you, but pray as though it all depends on
>God.
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux is so stable...
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:47:50 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell) wrote in
<8hk1qc$1f52$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>For linux-linux sharing, at least where the users are equivalent
>I'd always choose NFS over samba. It is designed to survive
>reboots on either side. I don't think the smbfs code is as
>well tested.
I'm using Samba as my other boot system is Windows. I did consider
installing NFS as well as Samba but then I thought Samba would be up to the
job. Now you tell me smbfs is not as well tested... 8)
Pete
------------------------------
Subject: Re: SVGALib
From: Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 07 Jun 2000 14:47:27 -0600
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> Another example of Linux lacking. You have to insert code in order to
> take a screen dump...Pitiful this Linux is...Pitiful indeed...
You obviously don't know what SVGAlib is.
--
The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
Subject: Re: HTML Help files (an updated set of man pages)
From: Greg Yantz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 07 Jun 2000 16:52:47 -0400
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin) writes:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Richardson) wrote in
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> >Perhaps he is saying that linux is better for _him_ than windows. I know
> >I do. Perhaps windows is better for you, if so, you should consider
> >sticking with windows. Not to discourage you from trying linux, but you
> >don't post this stuff to any of the linux help newsgroups, just to
> >advocacy, why is that?
> I'm trying to point out to Linux bigots (i.e. not you as you're being
> fairly reasonable in the style of conversation) that the rants and raves
> they make is simply hot air!
How nice.
> >And yet you didn't know much about man pages or cut and paste in X?
> I know enough about man pages to know it's an inferior help system.
For your needs, perhaps. If you actually need detailed information,
man pages are extremely useful. If you don't want to think, you have a
relatively common problem and need a guided troubleshooting walk-through,
then the Windows help system rocks.
> As for cut and paste on X it seems to be a precursor of what I've seen
> on better systems - by that I mean Windows.
Ah, presenting a personal opinion as Truth. OK.
Hey Pot, stop bothering the Kettle.
-Greg
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux is so stable...
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:54:21 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (David Utidjian) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Finally!!! THANK YOU. After a bazillion messages caling people names and
>whatnot we have the "real thing"...
Sorry it took me so long. I'm not that familiar with the logs files on
Linux, until someone pointed me in the right direction.
>It appears you had a samba share from some other machine mounted at the
>time of the reboot, is that correct? If so it appears that the kernel
>was unable to unmount (umount) the SMB filesystem gracefully. The most
>common reason for this is that some shell or some program somewhere was
>in the SMB filesystem at the time. That is to say... If you had, say,
>smbmounted a directory like "/foo" and there was some shell that was
>still in "/foo" then the shutdown would complain. Possible there was a
>read/write going on when you did the shutdown.
That's correct, the other slower machine maintains Samba shares so I can
read them on my faster system which has both Windows 98 SE and Linux.
I'm not sure anything was accessing the Samba share as the system was going
down.
>What exactly were you doing with this smbmounted filesystem? I am not
>being accusatory, I just want to know what you may have been doing and
>why so that I can avoid the same problem... and/or help you fix it.
I use the shares for various files, like application kits, MP3s etc. It's
Samba as I want to access it from Windows.
>It also appears that the shutdown was continuing on OK just as you hit
>the button. All of this appears to have happened within the same second
>of time... (Jun 3 22:23:53 bigpc kernel: smb.... ***** to ***** Jun 3
>22:23:53 bigpc random: Saving random seed succeeded) after that... about
>2 seconds later the normal kernel shutdown messages continued.
I copied up to what seemed like the last log entry on that day. The next
entry is Jun 4th when I next rebooted Linux.
>What happened right after the last lien you pasted? (Jun 3 22:23:55
>bigpc exiting on signal 15) Usually, the next line would have been (Jun
>3 22:23:55 bigpc syslogd x.y-z: restart.)... which would indicate a
>successful restart. Either you missed that part of the log OR you hit
>the reset button just as it was about to reboot.
The system hung for a while (not sure how long, seconds, minutes?). I've
never seen Linux die on a shutdown so I hit the reset button. I next
rebooted to Windows as that's where I wanted to go anyway.
Pete
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Microsoft OS, no full OS CD Re: More Dirty Microsoft Tactics
From: Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 07 Jun 2000 14:53:09 -0600
"Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> NOW <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> > >
> > > Something to think about is this. Major OEM's *CHOOSE* to use this
> method.
> > > The OEM could easily buy complete OEM liscenses from MS as well, but
> they
> > > would end up paying a slightly higher price. OEM's are doing this to
> hike
> > > up their profits.
> >
> >
> > Well, in 1995 this was true... and I hated Dell for causing me
> > days of downtime to avoid sending a $1.50 cdrom along with
> > my $3100 computer. But did you read this from the first cited
> > link?
> >
> > (http://www.infoworld.com/articles/op/xml/00/05/01/000501opfoster.xml)
> >
> > "After conferring with Microsoft again, my OEM could only tell me
> > that my concerns were very real ones, but Microsoft just says they
> > know we're not going to like this but this is how it's going to be."
> >
> > Furthermore,
> >
> > "According to Microsoft representatives, as of April 1 the company
> > changed its OEM media policies for all versions of Windows except
> > for the Server Edition of Windows 2000, for which one still gets a
> > regular backup CD"
> >
> > This isn't coming from the OEMs. Microsoft changed its policies
> > underneath the OEMs, and left it to them to break it to us, the
> > customer.
> > I haven't seen any indication that Microsoft lowered its prices
> > to the OEMs at the time they shortened the leash on cd distribution.
> >
> > Maybe it's true that the OEMs could jack up their payments to
> > Microsoft to regain the former distribution rights. But raising
> > prices without offering extra benefits or services is just the
> > kind of thing Microsoft can get away with only because of
> > who they are.
>
> Also from the same link:
>
> "Microsoft has quietly implemented a policy through which OEM hardware
> manufacturers who license Windows directly from Microsoft no longer ship a
> full backup CD of the OS with their systems."
>
> In other words, the policy only effects OEM that's directly liscense windows
> from MS, rather than OEM's that buy Windows from a distributor. The OEM's
> that liscense directly from MS do so because they have large volume and can
> negotiate better prices than distributors sell at. The OEM does this to
> save money.
But Eric, consider 2 OEMs:
1) Doesn't sell machines with CD
2) Does sell machines with CD
Otherwise, everything else is exactly the same. Which one will be
cheaper? Which one will be more likeley purchased? Which OEM will
switch over to lower her costs?
> Also from the same link:
>
> From the third link:
>
> http://www.infoworld.com/articles/op/xml/00/06/05/000605opfoster.xml
>
> "Others opined that the large PC manufacturers, rather than Microsoft, might
> be driving the no-CD bandwagon. "Microsoft may be removing the full Windows
> CD to eliminate piracy, but there is another likely scenario," suggested one
> official at a small PC manufacturer that does not license Windows directly
> from Microsoft. "It's also possible that the major manufacturers asked
> Microsoft to eliminate everything except the license to reduce their costs
> and Microsoft said OK. I noted in your article [last week] that most of the
> nasty-sounding quotes attributed to Microsoft actually came from
> manufacturer's reps. I'll bet that the direct-license manufacturers could
> buy and include the full package if they wanted to." "
It amounts to the same thing, either way.
Couldn't you at least admit, just once, that Microsoft is *maybe*
making a big mistake here?
--
The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux is so stable...
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:56:26 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (JEDIDIAH) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Sometimes you have to consider the source...
Keep wearing that blind spot. It suits you well.
> Past a certain point, civility is wasted effort.
You were never civil in the first place. You quickly fell to calling "you
shithead liar".
Pete
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Subject: Re: Microsoft OS, no full OS CD Re: More Dirty Microsoft Tactics
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 20:57:26 GMT
On 07 Jun 2000 14:53:09 -0600, Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>But Eric, consider 2 OEMs:
>
> 1) Doesn't sell machines with CD
>
> 2) Does sell machines with CD
>
>Otherwise, everything else is exactly the same. Which one will be
>cheaper? Which one will be more likeley purchased? Which OEM will
>switch over to lower her costs?
>
Give me a fucking break. A CD costs less than 40 cents to include.
By your logic, no PC should ever include a power cord.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Bob's Law
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 21:00:31 GMT
Mayor writes:
>> Bob Lyday writes:
>>> Bob's Law invoked. Tholen mentioned. Thread is now
>>> officially dead.
>> Illogical.
> Since when has logic had anything to do with Usenet?
Since I started posting. Perhaps even before that.
------------------------------
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ftp.funet.fi pub/Linux
tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
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