Linux-Advocacy Digest #980, Volume #26 Thu, 8 Jun 00 17:13:06 EDT
Contents:
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north (nohow)
SAMBA question (Camilo Rostoker)
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north (Forrest Gehrke)
Re: SAMBA question (Cihl)
Re: Why Linux should be #1 choice for students! ("James")
Re: How many years for Linux to catch up to NT on the desktop ? (Leslie Mikesell)
Re: The Mainframe VS the PC. ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: WHICH LINUX??? NONE!!! (Gary Hallock)
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north (Gregory L. Hansen)
Re: HTML Help files (an updated set of man pages) (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Linux is so stable... (Pete Goodwin)
Re: How many years for Linux to catch up to NT on the desktop ? (Leslie Mikesell)
Re: How many years for Linux to catch up to NT on the desktop ? (Leslie Mikesell)
Re: The Mainframe VS the PC. ("Christopher Smith")
Re: Linux is so stable... (Pete Goodwin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: nohow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 13:15:29 -0700
On Thu, 08 Jun 2000 10:28:32 -0400, Jack Troughton
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Mike Stephen wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, 7 Jun 3900 15:57:32, Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > On 06/05/2000 at 07:58 PM,
>> > Monkeyboy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>> >
>> > > > > Most historians agree that in the end, the Canadians were the victors.
>> > > >
[snip]
>> As for the orbit of the first man, no... Canadians were not
>> involved.... That was entirely a Russian endeavour. However if
>> you care to look up who ran the Mercury, Gemini and Apollo
>> projects, you will find it was run by many Canadians. If you
>> ever get to talk to an actual NASA employee of those years, they
>> will fondly refer to the "Canucks" that ran the show.
>
>Dunno about that... probably refugees from the Avro Arrow program.
>Dief was an idiot; I personally know three people of that generation
>that dumped the conservative party because of Diefenbaker's decision
>to scrap the Arrow program.
>
>http://www.totavia.com/arrow/
>
>The Avro Arrow was well and truly ahead of its time... like warp,
>you could say:)
>
It's the classic case of building an great product without knowing
what the market wants. In this case there was little or no demand for
high altitude, long range interceptors.
------------------------------
From: Camilo Rostoker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: SAMBA question
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 14:14:14 -0600
Okay,
I won't ask how to set up SAMBA, because I've seen too many other people
plead like that. rather, a more specific question. In the manual it
says to force Windows 95/85 to use unencrypted passwords to set a
registry setting in ...../VxD/services/
and put in a new DWORD, with name=UsePlainTextPassword, and value=0x01.
My question is that when I get asked to enter the value, do I put in
exactly 01, so that the final binary digit is similar to 0x0000001, or
do i put in 10000 so that the binary digit is 0x010000 ?? Any help on
getting this to work?
Cheers,
Camilo
------------------------------
From: Forrest Gehrke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 20:15:46 GMT
Bob Germer wrote:
> On 06/07/2000 at 10:58 PM,
> Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
> > Bob Germer wrote:
> > >
> > > There were at least 5 major word processing programs for the Intel
> > > platform in 1984 when these decisions were made, WordStar, Word,
> > > WordPerfect, Volkswriter, and one whose name I don't recall.
>
> > IBM DisplayWriter perhaps? Was Broderbund's "Bank Street Writer" around
> > back then?
>
> I had forgotten DisplayWriter. No I was thinking of a product put out by
> Brown Bag Software. I didn't have any experience with Bank Street, but it
> was a player to be sure. I also forgot that Lotus also came out with what
> became AmiPro long before there was a MS monopoly.
There was also XyWrite (which I still use) whose popularity was mostly with
people who dealt with copy intended for mainframes as the files were
readable by the mainframe program such as reporters and magazine
writers. While this wp is character oriented it was written in Intel assembly
language and nothing begins to approach its speed even today. Of course with
today's high clock speed cpu's that point has little relevance. An offshoot of
this wp is NotaBene.
Multimate was another wp which., like DisplayWriter, was decended
from dedicated machines (not PC';s) and had a large following because
many users knew how to use it..
There was another called Textra which was popular because of its very
low cost.
The point is that in the late 1980's there were many word processors for
the Intel PC put out by publishers all of whom were moderately successful
until Word Perfect became the largest market share and froze the smaller ones
out. MS was present early on with Word using wysiwyg which gradually
overcame WordPerfect (who sat on their hands too long to adopt wysiwyg).
//
------------------------------
From: Cihl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: SAMBA question
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 20:24:59 GMT
Camilo Rostoker wrote:
>
> Okay,
> I won't ask how to set up SAMBA, because I've seen too many other people
> plead like that. rather, a more specific question. In the manual it
> says to force Windows 95/85 to use unencrypted passwords to set a
> registry setting in ...../VxD/services/
> and put in a new DWORD, with name=UsePlainTextPassword, and value=0x01.
> My question is that when I get asked to enter the value, do I put in
> exactly 01, so that the final binary digit is similar to 0x0000001, or
> do i put in 10000 so that the binary digit is 0x010000 ?? Any help on
> getting this to work?
> Cheers,
> Camilo
Enter 1.
--
A world without poverty, a world without greed.
One without armies, without borders, .
We CAN do it ourselves, we MUST do it ourselves.
For everybody, from everybody.
------------------------------
From: "James" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why Linux should be #1 choice for students!
Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2000 22:22:32 +0200
I never mentioned MS Word ?!?
"Colin R. Day" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> James wrote:
>
> > Yup, wish I had Linux (and a PC) in '80. However, Win2k and the
numerous
> > commercial packages for it would have been better for producing
> > reports/theses.
>
> How is MS Word better than TeX/LATeX in this regard?
>
> Colin Day
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell)
Subject: Re: How many years for Linux to catch up to NT on the desktop ?
Date: 8 Jun 2000 15:31:13 -0500
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>But you seem to be the one who thinks everyone else's box
>>must have the same problems as yours.
>
>Thanks for putting words in my mouth. I never said that. I said I have
>certain problems, yet other people call me liar when I report them.
I've never called you a liar, yet I am surprised when you describe
things that I know do not match a stock Mandrake system and
omit any mention of changing it.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Mainframe VS the PC.
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 20:26:56 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Drestin Black" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> "Charlie Ebert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Originally the PC was cheaper thanks to Microsoft!
> >
> > Now the PC is more expensive, again thanks to Microsoft!
>
> PC is more expensive? excuse me? PC prices are lower than ever. Can
you
> explain in ANY way shape or form your claim they are more expensive
(thanks
> to anyone?)?
You have made the classic rookie mistake of ceasing your study at the
price sticker on the shiny box.
Total Cost of Ownership (that which accountants & engineers use, NOT the
M$ version) adds maintenance costs AND slack time to the sticker price.
You know what "maintenance costs" means. Reinstalling the apps, FDisk &
format, etc., etc.
"Slack time" is an archaic concept, but it still counts. If a user
performs an operation, and it takes a whole hour, and that user's
employment costs the company $10.00 per hour, then that operation costs
$10.00. If a software "upgrade" extends the time required to perform
the same operation to 1.5 hours, the operation now costs $15.00. You
follow me on that? Time is money, that sort of thing.
So what a lot of people miss in the GUI mess is that the burden cost of
the GUI really does cost a lot. It does NOT pay, unless you pay your
users to point & click on cute little pictures. Most companies pay
their employees to produce marketable product or to track same. To
either generate revenue or keep track of the revenue generated.
So how does this show WinNT on a new PC costs more than MS-DOS on a 386?
Take the aforementioned example. If the user in question performs that
operation once a day, that's 5 times a week, which is 260 times a year.
That puts the "pre-upgrade" cost of that operation at $2600.00 per year.
After the upgrade (it now costs $15.00, remember), the annualized cost
of that operation is $3900, an increase of $1300.
Okay, I just pulled numbers straight out of my backside, for
simplicity's sake. YMMV. So you either see the point, or you've been
indoctrinated into the M$ B$ way of ignoring reality.
I suspect a few M$ drones will trot out the tired old lie about
"productivity" with the GUI and how "intuitive" it is and that's
supposed to "improve" things. <yawn> Been there, heard that. Get a
frimping stopwatch, people, and quantify!!! Never mind the obvious lie
that a picture is somehow "intuitive"! Just pull up some actual numbers
as to how much does this GUI cost, on a transaction-by-transaction
basis, in Real Life!! DO IT!! I dare you. Back up your claim with
proof. You can plainly see for yourself that the GUI adds a burden to
the system! Show me how it lowers the TCO!
> >
> > You can by an AS 400 or HP 9000 of Dec VAX for under $100,000
> > and it will service 500 people!
> >
> > You can't buy the servers under a W2K environment for that!
>
> Um, absolutely you can. And for less. And for more people.
Um... Either you're lying, you're stealing, or you're pulling your
"facts" straight out of YOUR backside.
Challenge: I'm building a network. 500 users. I already have all the
parts except the host, which can be a Win2k Server, an AS400, or a VAX.
Give me your best price, with supporting documentation to include make &
model, features, and performance statistics, on a Win2k Server for my
500 users. And someone else give me a price on an AS400 for the same
role. I can already get the stats, etc. from IBM; they have nothing to
hide.
> >
> > And it definitely won't run as well or as fast either.
>
> Oh, I think that's already been proven false.
Oh, really? I look for these things all over. As an engineer, my job
depends on having this sort of information for my sales staff! Please
reply with a URL to something which supports your claim. I think you're
digging in the nether pores again.
> >
> > Mainframes will return to most companies thanks to Microsoft.
>
> Mainframes continue to decrease in sales in the US... check your
figures...
Well, I'm aftaid you're both wrong on this one. But that's off-topic.
Here're a few links where you can check this out for yourself:
http://www.actscorp.com/Tech_Papers___Articles/tkheart.htm
http://datamation.earthweb.com/servr/thinkwrap_960415.html
and
http://techedcon.com/mason720/SegmentStudies/SoftwareSysReportS2000.htm
> >
> > Or, you can retain your freedom as users and encourange your office
> > to go total LINUX now. Now while you still have freedoms.
>
> ok karl marx
>
Biased prejudice on the one hand, ad hominem attack on the other. Why
am I here? Babysitter?
Bye.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 16:51:41 -0400
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: WHICH LINUX??? NONE!!!
"C. Kolin Bakslas" wrote:
> Ever try opening a *.doc / *.xls / *.ppt / *.M$S / *.etc with kedit?
> How 'bout Staroffice?
> Staroffice proves bloat can be created for the *nix community.
> And why can't I scratch Staroffice without scratching my KDE
> installation????
> And furthermore: Where the hell is Lotus's port of Notes for *nix?!?
> Not Domino server, but just notes (with is wonderful vbs-like) LotusScript?
>
> Rogodeter Snowl
>
> --
> If I could I'd fang Bill into FOUR baby bills...
Lotus Notes is working so well under wine these days that a native port may not be
necessary. But it would be nice if Lotus would link a copy with winelib.
Gary
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gregory L. Hansen)
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Date: 8 Jun 2000 20:54:22 GMT
In article <393fabdf$6$obot$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On 06/07/2000 at 11:42 PM,
> Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
>> >
>> > Ah. Compare and contrast with AppleScript, perhaps?
>
>> I know nothing of AppleScript. REXX, however, can be used to do darn
>> near anything in OS/2, including GUI, multimedia, and TCP/IP
>> applications, and can be extended to use custom APIs of your own.
>> There's also an OO version in the Warp 4 installation.
>
>Applescript is more akin to a dos batch file than Rexx. It is much less
>capable, doesn't allow direct compiling to an executable, etc. It is not
>capable of TCP/IP, etc.
the thing that makes AppleScript cool is its ability to control other
software. For instance, it may not be able to download a file over the
internet, but it could tell Netscape to do so. So it doesn't have a lot
of functionality built in, it really depends on scriptable applications,
including the Finder. You can't really delete a file with AppleScript,
for instance. It tells the Finder to delete that file. And because it is
ubiquitous and sanctioned, there is a clear path for making applications
scriptable, and certain scriptable things that every program must be able
to do (open on demand, close on demand, etc.) I dare say there's hardly
any point to writing AppleScripts unless it's launching and controlling
other things.
For more general-purpose programming you should probably pick up MacPerl,
MacPython, or various others.
--
If I had a nickel for everytime someone said "If I had a nickel for every
time someone said..."...
------------------------------
Subject: Re: HTML Help files (an updated set of man pages)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 20:54:56 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Greg Yantz) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>For your needs, perhaps. If you actually need detailed information,
>man pages are extremely useful. If you don't want to think, you have a
>relatively common problem and need a guided troubleshooting
>walk-through, then the Windows help system rocks.
But man pages lack one thing - the ability to link to other man pages. You
can't hyperlink to other topics, you have to start from scratch at the
command prompt. HTML offers that, so why has Linux remained with its
antiquated man system, when there are at least better alternatives?
Pete
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux is so stable...
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 20:59:35 GMT
No-Spam (Terry Porter) wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Its simple, "Goodwin" is just another Wintroll. He is currently going
>thru the same steps most Wintrols do.
Another with a blind spot. Does Linux rot the brain?
>Currently he's at the "pure of heart, Windows using, Linux fault finding
>stage"
You've seen it all before have you? You've prejudged it all, you've heard
it all... if ever I heard someone with a mind closed, you're it.
Pete
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell)
Subject: Re: How many years for Linux to catch up to NT on the desktop ?
Date: 8 Jun 2000 15:50:58 -0500
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>
>>
>> Same thing here, Print causes a virtual shutdown.
This is most likely the parallel port generating an interrupt
on every character that is not being serviced. It has been
a long time since I've seen that problem and I've forgotten
what to do about it. tunelp might be a good start.
>Usually, when you screw up a configuration item, you get
>problems. For example, if I unplug my network cable, Linux
>takes a lot longer to boot while three different network daemons
>each time out in turn.
That one is easier - just be sure you can resolve all of
the names needed at bootup yourself (via the /etc/hosts
file or your own nameserver) so you don't wait for DNS
to fail.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell)
Subject: Re: How many years for Linux to catch up to NT on the desktop ?
Date: 8 Jun 2000 15:59:27 -0500
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>Which process caused the problem? If you don't have a postscript
>>printer, graphics end up being rendered to bitmaps by ghostscript
>>but unless you are short on RAM and it makes the machine swap
>>it should not cause the system to crawl.
>
>As soon as I managed to stop the printer queue, the slow crawl stop. It
>took me a while to figure out lprm removes a print job, so I deleted it and
>restarted the queue.
If it is the print output itself and not any of the preprocessing
for graphics, the port is generating interrupts that aren't being
handled right. Look in your bios,
http://metalab.unc.edu/mdw/HOWTO/Printing-HOWTO.html
and try the tunelp utility.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Christopher Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Mainframe VS the PC.
Date: Fri, 9 Jun 2000 07:02:12 +1000
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:8hovhq$h9n$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> "Drestin Black" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I suspect a few M$ drones will trot out the tired old lie about
> "productivity" with the GUI and how "intuitive" it is and that's
> supposed to "improve" things. <yawn> Been there, heard that. Get a
> frimping stopwatch, people, and quantify!!! Never mind the obvious lie
> that a picture is somehow "intuitive"! Just pull up some actual numbers
> as to how much does this GUI cost, on a transaction-by-transaction
> basis, in Real Life!! DO IT!! I dare you. Back up your claim with
> proof. You can plainly see for yourself that the GUI adds a burden to
> the system! Show me how it lowers the TCO!
So, how's your 80x25 text mode image editor coming along ?
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux is so stable...
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Pete Goodwin)
Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 21:02:49 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Pete, you are dealing with a rabid, tunnel vision idiot.
Rabid and tunnel vision, maybe, but idiot, no.
>He most likely weighs 400 lbs and has never been laid.
That's a bit unkind to any 400 lb unlaid individuals out there.
>He runs Linux, need I say more?
>
>You have tried Linux.
>What do YOU think of it, honestly?
It has potential, needs more work.
>Da' Sponge has been there and back. Linux is butt a mere fart on the way
>to nirvana. Win 2k IS nirvana, it so completely blows away Linshit it
>isn't even funny.
Oh I've seen Windows 2000, I've played games on Windows 2000 and it blows
away Windows 98 SE as a games machine. I've written GUI's and Device
Drivers for Windows 2000... but is it nirvana? I'm still waiting for that
one.
Pete
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
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